Joan BEAUFORT, Queen of Scots - Too Many Children

Started by Craig Andrew Miles on Sunday, January 8, 2023
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Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joan_Beaufort,_Queen_of_Scots lists Joan as having the following 11 children:

Margaret, Dauphine of France
Isabella, Duchess of Brittany
Eleanor, Archduchess of Austria
Mary, Countess of Buchan
Joan, Countess of Morton
Alexander, Duke of Rothesay
James II, King of Scotland
Annabella, Countess of Huntly
John, 1st Earl of Atholl
James, 1st Earl of Buchan
Andrew, Bishop of Moray

I dont know if Wikipedia is correct or not but somehow this poor woman is listed as having 23 children, which is surely impossible and at best highly unlikely?

Joan Beaufort, Queen of Scots My 18th great aunt.

My maternal great-grandmother had 13 children: Hazel Marie Hudson They don't build them like they used to.

Joan Beaufort, Queen of Scots is my 17th great grandmother.

Only the first eleven are her children. The rest beginning with the Nevilles should be deleted.

Richard Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's son by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:05 AM
Richard Neville, 5th Earl of Salisbury
Richard Neville, 5th Earl of Salisbury

Eleanor Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:05 AM
Eleanor Neville, Countess of Northumberland
Eleanor Neville, Countess of Northumberland

Lady Maud Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:01 AM
Maud de Neville, Lady Mauley
Maud de Neville, Lady Mauley

Lady Philippa Baroness Dacre Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:01 AM
Lady Philippa de Neville, Baroness Dacre
Lady Philippa de Neville, Baroness Dacre

Sir John Raby of Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's son by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:01 AM
Sir John Neville, Kt.
Sir John Neville, Kt.

Sister Elizabeth Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:01 AM
Elizabeth de Neville
Elizabeth de Neville

Lady Anne Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:01 AM
Anne Neville, the elder
Anne Neville, the elder

Auray Isabella Stuart was added as James I, King of Scots's child by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 8:00 AM
Annabella of Scotland
Isabella of Scotland, Duchess of Brittany

Cecily Neville was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 7:58 AM
Cecily Neville, Duchess of York
Cecily Neville, Duchess of York

Princess Johanna was added as James I, King of Scots's daughter by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 7:58 AM
Joan of Scotland, Countess of Morton

John Stuart was added as James I, King of Scots's son by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 7:58 AM
John Stewart, 1st Earl of Atholl

Andrew Stuart was added as James I, King of Scots's son by Sandra Kay Fletcher.
Dec 2, 2022 at 7:58 AM
Andrew Stewart, Bishop of Moray
_________________________________________

Looks like our Joan got confused with Joan Beaufort, Countess of Westmorland (for starters).

Private User - how does this even happen? The profiles were locked and should not have allowed for new entries.

(Thanks to Debra’s list, I’ll start merging into the real profiles).

Erica Howton — i don’t understand how that happened. As you say, the profiles were locked.

Surely another curator took the lock off and then relocked? Lord knows it wasn’t me.

But that doesn’t show up in the revisions list, does it? That just goes silently by.

But I don’t know of any other way this could have happened, unless alas the locks don’t actually work anymore.

Could have been caused by a "Smart Match"? I noticed GenealogieOnline sources for the added profiles. Are those profiles added automatically just by clicking on smart match? (I have no experience with smart matches, so wondered if that was how it happened.)

It is unlikely to be exactly correct but may be. It did use to occasionally happen. Also, undoubtedly, in the days of much higher birth rates and higher incidence of parent(s) mortality leaving behind orphans, those orphans would be taken into other families as one of their own. It was almost unheard of in those days to allow homelessness. Also, divorces happened occasionally, and remarriages would often bring the joining of stepsiblings as if all were full siblings. The records would not indicate so. The older a mother got in childbearing years the more likely she would suffer a fatal complication giving birth, after already having many children. Remember, birth control then was abstinence and that was it.

Unless you are an active researcher though I would not worry too much about it. Myself, as I am not actively researching for a few years now, letting DNA and others research fill in the blanks on my tree with the goal in about 5 years from now going through my now gargantuan GENI.com tree and seeing just how much of it is backed up with written documentation from the time period in question.

Private User - no, nothing to do with smart matches. And the locks worked just fine when I merged the Dec 2 entries into locked MPs. We will ask Geni support to look into it. Your list was invaluable.

It does seem to me that in some circumstances, revisions are not recorded for changes. I would have thought that this should not be the case - it is certainly not desirable - but does seem to be happening.

For example, the removal of all of those additional children is not logged as a revision.

Is this a curator thing? Regardless, I think that the audit trail should still be recorded.

Vi i am a gran,gran child of Joan Beaufort,and she got many of them😀

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