Élisabeth de Rethel

Erica Howton C

7/25/2022 at 4:49 AM

She’s not listed at Medlands as daughter of Gervais, count of Rethel & Elizabeth de Rethel / de Rosoy

http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ENGLISHNOBILITYMEDIEVAL3L-O.htm#Rob...

Robert [III] & his wife had two children:

1. ROBERT Marmion [IV] (-before Oct 1181). … m ---. The name of Robert’s wife has not been found. The Complete Peerage names “Elizabeth, daughter of Gervase, son of Hugh Count of Rethel” as the wife of Robert Marmion [IV] without citing any primary source on which it bases this statement[116]. As noted above, it is more likely that the daughter of Gervais de Rethel was the wife of Robert Marmion [III].

Robert [IV] & his wife had one child:

a) ROBERT Marmion [V] (-before [1217]). "Robert Marmion, fils de Robert" confirmed the donations to the abbey of Barberie made by his father by charter dated Oct 1181[117]. - see below.

Private User

7/25/2022 at 6:39 AM

Apparently "Elizabeth de Rethel" is Fictional, possibly due to confusion between Melisende, her mother, and the various Robert Marmions of the period.

It was definitely Melisende who was gifted with the manor of Stanton by Queen Adeliza (her kinswoman) as a result of Melisende's marriage to whichever Robert Marmion best fits the chronology. The marriage was short-lived (he died), and Melisende brought the manor to her second husband, Richard (whichever one *he* was) de Camville.

The Marmions are, unfortunately, not the only confusion here.

The short of it is that by about 1192 Melisende's only surviving heir was her daughter, variously named "Isabel" or "Melisende" de Camville, who was married to Robert d'Harcourt. The manor conveyed to Robert "jure uxoris", and has ever since been known as "Stanton Harcourt".

Erica Howton C

7/25/2022 at 6:44 AM

Another great grandpa bites the dust …

Thanks, Private User

Élisabeth de Rethel - Origins?

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