Robert II “Fronteboeuf” d’Estouteville - Could his wife and mother be confused?

Thanks for the discussion Dale,
I am the curator who put together the d'Estouteville descendance in Geni recently, tracking both the French and English lines down 16-18 generations. As you have pointed out, there is a bit of contradictory evidence at the early time periods of this family. When the genealogy was put together a conscious decisions was made to consistently follow certain specific sources, which I have listed in the Overview section of many d'Estouteville profiles. I began with Cawley and Medlands then, because he refers to ONLY primary sources he can miss particular siblings or wives who are not mentioned in such. I then resorted to Pattou at Racines et Histoire, then to Mondriere and finally the Dictionary de la noblesse. Even within these four sources there is difference so it boiled down to which source does one believe the most accurate, and I tried to remain consistent in that decision making.

Give me a bit of time to review your notes and references and I will recall how I approached these two gentlemen and arrived at the decisions made. One of the people who is most ubiquitous is Jeanne de Tallebot, the sources have her all over the place.

A couple of things:
First, it is important to be consistent in using sources, it is easier to jump from one to another to make things fit, so I want to limit the sourcing to those shown in my bibliography (which I have copied below).
Secondly, I don't use community internet trees such as cybergata because internet genealogy has become nothing more than mastering the art of copy and paste, I can show you spelling error in the same place in multiple trees, so I don't find the data that convincing.
Thirdly, having said 1 & 2, I am absolutely open to making corrections if we can come to a consensus based on the historical data. I am going to add Anne Brannen to the discussion, she is a curator with a lot of experience in Medieval Europe.

Bibliography
De La Chesnaye Des Bois, Aubert, and Jacques Badier. Dictionary of the Nobility: Containing the Genealogies, the History and the Chronology of the Noble Families of France. Vol. 7, A Paris, 1863) https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k5424928x/f265.item

De La Morandière, Gabriel. History of the House of Estouteville in Normandy. A Paris, 1903 https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k5608689r.texteImage

de La Roque de La Lontière, Gilles-André. Histoire généalogique de la maison de Harcourt, A Paris, 1664 https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k118111n

Cawley, Charles. “NORMANDY ARQUES, AUMÂLE, CAUX, ROUEN, EU.” Medieval Lands, 10 Oct. 2019, http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/. https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/normacre.htm#NicholasEstoutevilled...

Pattou, Etienne. “Estouteville.” Racines Et Histoire, http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Estouteville.pdf

1. Cartulaires de Montmartre et de Saint-Merry de Paris (Sorbonne) 2. Héraldique & Généalogie, http://www.heralogic.eu/txt_bs1866_evmon.html : Armorial 3. des Evêques de Montpellier - par M. A. Fourtier - 1866, 4. Dictionnaire de la Noblesse (F. A. Aubert de La Chesnaye-Desbois, éd. 1775, Héraldique & Généalogie), 5. Contributions multiples et détaillées de Michel de Camp (à propos de la Grande-Maîtrise des Arbalétriers de France, & l’Héraldique des Prévôts de Paris et, plus généralement, de toute la Maison d’Estouteville)
“Base De Données Généalogique.” Roglo, http://roglo.eu/roglo?lang=en

“THE GENEALOGICAL ROUND - from ESTOUTTEVILLE & TUTTAVILLA .” Gnalogie LAISN, 3 Aug. 2002, http://herve.laine-bucaille.pagesperso-orange.fr/index.htm

Sanders, I. J. ENGLISH BARONIES A STUDY OF THEIR ORIGIN AND DESCENT 1086-1132. London: Oxford University Press, 1960. (Not available to read online, I own a copy of the book)

Burke, Bernard, 1814-1892. A Genealogical And Heraldic Dictionary of the Landed Gentry of Great Britain And Ireland ... London: Harrison, 1858.

Overton, Charles. The History of Cottingham. J.W. Leng, 1861. https://books.google.com/books/about/The_History_of_Cottingham.html...

Planché, James Robinson. ‪The Conqueror and His Companions, Volume 2, Somerset Herald, London, Tinsley Brothers, 1874. ‬https://books.google.com/books/about/The_Conqueror_and_His_Companio...

Early Yorkshire Charters: Volume 9, The Stuteville Fee. United Kingdom, Cambridge University Press, 2013. (Available online in snippets only, I own a copy of the book)

Family Trees on Geneanet for the purpose of cross-checking dates and places: “Family Tree of Alain FOULLON.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/foullon “Family Tree of Henri PICHOT.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/hpichot “Family Tree of Hélène PAREY.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/hparey “Family Tree of Guy HERVELEU.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/gherveleu “Family Tree of Guillaume de WAILLY.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/wailly “Family Tree of Louis BRUN.” Geneanet, https://en.geneanet.org/profil/zardoz

A final source which I have not reviewed yet but which is referenced by many of the French tress I use to cross check data is Père Anselm de Saint Marie

Sainte-Marie, Anselme de, and M. du. Fourny. Histoire Généalogique Et Chronologique De La Maison Royale De France, Des Pairs, Grands Officiers De La Couronne De La Maison Du Roy Et Des Anciens Barons Du Royaume. Vol. 9, Par La Compagnie Des Libraires, 1733. https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k76026j.image

I'm very uncomfortable anytime I think Cawley, is wrong. As you said, there are conflicting sources and that means trying to decide who is most likely correct.
Thanks for the extra sources. I'll be going over them.

Dale,
I've uploaded two files to the documents tab that formed the basis of the research that I went with. Please see
-Notes on Estouteville
-Gabriel de La Morandière, translation of

Also look closely at page two of Etienne Pattou's research here: http://racineshistoire.free.fr/LGN/PDF/Estouteville.pdf

A note on Cawley: its important to remember that he ONLY researched primary documents and it is not uncommon therefore that wives and siblings are not mentioned in Medlands if they are not referenced in those documents.

Also note in Medlands for d'Estouteville, Cawley prefaces his section with this: "According to Le Prévost, this family originated in "Etouteville-sur-Mer, canton d’Yerville"[240], situated in the Pays de Caux about 30 kilometers north-west of Rouen. This family has been studied by Gabriel de la Morandière[241]. He appears to clarify adequately the relationship between the Estouteville family in Normandy and the Stuteville family in England. However, his account of the descent of the various branches of the English Stuteville family is confused and contradictory."

Then you will note that he proceeds to reference Morandière throughout!

For my part, I always start with Medlands, but then supplement it from other sources.

I think what you see is the assignment of wives that has been the "standard" approach on many sites, but I think that the way we approached it on Geni likely more accurate, given of course that we are dealing is both scenarios with very old information.

Two other drivers:
Look deep into Jeanne Talbot and you will see a very wide date range for her life in other trees so it's not easy to be precise, which effectively "allows" her to work as Geni shows it.
Also look into Marie de Mulan, she also is quite unknown. I believe that there are postings on Geni in her profile, I seem to recall a recent discussion on her as a well know but mysterious poet.