Sir William Sinclair of Roslin, 6th Lord of Rosslyn - Robert, not William?

Retrying link: https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/pardreman.htm#RobertSaintClairdied...

Justin had the father of William Sinclair as Robert, but that it's Henry shows up elsewhere -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barony_of_Roslin for instance.

Thanks. Missed that.

Should I unlink? Happy to leave it you too.

I don't think he needs unlinking since Scots Peerage mentions him as the son of the parents he's connected to:

THE SCOTS PEERAGE had to say about the early Sinclairs. It says in relevant part: Sir William Sinclair, according to Father Hay, was the son of Robert de Saintclair in Normandy, and his wife Eleanor, relict of Hugh, Lord of Chateauneuf, daughter to Robert, second Comte de Dreux, in France by Joland of Coucy, his wife.

There are copious notes in William's profile.

Primary Sources?

Also notes seem to raise a question about the parentage as well.

Balfour Paul seems to be particularly good at not citing sources, so I'd want to query it - but not invested in this either, so I'll leave it to you guys.

The direct source would be The Scots Peerage.

I'd like to get it right because they're my direct ancestors. Maybe Anne Brennen has more sources than we can access.

Agree with Debbie

The 1900s Scottish Peerage and Balfour Paul are about 700 yrs away from being direct sources.
I've invited you both to the Working With Sources project - which explains this: https://www.geni.com/projects/Working-with-sources/18201

I'm not invested in removing the relationship - just came here to support you on your Eleanor search - so, whatever you decide is good with me - SP is widely used on geni but, without finding primary sources I'm inclined to go with Cawley (who sooner or later seems to find direct sources, if there are any ) https://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/pardreman.htm#RobertSaintClairdied...

This Hay in the About seems to be closer to a primary source and "this version of Hay's genealogy of theSinclairs, at 2-3, shows the descent of the Sinclairs to be from "one Sir William Sinclare, second sone to Woldonius or Wildernus, in France, whose mother was daughter to Duke Richard"--an uncle of William the Conqueror. No mention is made of the deDreux family"

Hay is SPs primary source by the looks of things... and his original doesn't have these parents but rather has Sir William Sinclare as second son to Woldonius or Wildernus & a daughter of Duke Richard.

? A conundrum .
To quote someone else here on GENI
" If we had to rely on difinitive written sources and prove only ; where would we be with the ancestors of the indigenous people in South Africa , Africa , Australasia or the Americas ? "
Similar with Europe and this instance .
DNA and atDNA might help us resolve this in the near future.
e.g. Appel/Botha ancestry in South Africa finally resolved with DNA ?

Maybe in overview reference to different sources for different parents exist ?

Sharon I agree with this.

https://www.geni.com/projects/Working-with-sources/18201

However problem I see is that more than 50 % of managers or curators of SV/Prog profiles in South Africa do not pay any attention to this or common sense e.g. Gerrit Janz van Deventer born 1667 in Netherlands parents were living in America at the time ?

That's an earlier William. He marries an earl's daughter and has a son Henry, who lives in the Conqueror's days. Henry marries an earl's daughter and has a son Henry who marries …

He starts the story again on page 3, apparently citing a different source.

He recaps it on page 32, citing a different source. Then on page 34 he says "All what is above recorded by the Genealogists doth not agree with the Evidences…"

That's not true though. Oral history IS a primary source - especially if first hand. You can write down what your granny told you about her granny (who she knew in the flesh) and that's a primary source. The minute it becomes 'mythical' we indicate so on the profile.

700 + years ago we definitely need primary sources because between then and now are too many vested interests who manipulated the lines for money and prestige.
If there is no primary or close source - there is no valid historical/ genealogical profile.

Thanks Brian is 'he' Hay or Balfour Paul?

Re: However problem I see is that more than 50 % of managers or curators of SV/Prog profiles in South Africa do not pay any attention to this or common sense e.g. Gerrit Janz van Deventer born 1667 in Netherlands parents were living in America at the time ?

Crowd sourcing data has the huge benefit of amassing a great deal of data very quickly. The work is in checking it. It's the nature of the beast. If you want access to the quantity, you've got to be prepared to work on the quality yourself.

As to Janz van Deventer born - is there a Discussion you've started that people are ignoring?

@ Brain -- thank you for doing a timeline .
All have the air of The Last kingdom TV show where 300 years get condensed into 50 years .
--who lives in the Conqueror's days-- Eleanor de Dreux born about 120 years later

Sorry, I was talking about Hay

https://hdl.handle.net/2027/nyp.33433081850483?urlappend=%3Bseq=68

He wasn't writing for publication. The book was printed by James Maidment long after his death.

Hope it goes here, this one needs a bit of help, I thought perhaps I could just look up a marriage date, but I think it will be more than updating marriage date, birth dates, etc. This ones over my head

https://www.geni.com/merge/view?revision_id=78995265570

It may have been a merge before this one I can't tell