Rabbi Zvulen Eliezer Heilprin - Two Fathers, Two Sons With Same Name

Hi;
I have not been closely following this discussion as I did not immediately remember this profile and its relatives. However it seems to have be part of a mess so I quickly looked up my source which I will state below. I will also try to type part of it in Hebrew.

There is a book at hebrewbooks.org call Avos Atara Lebanim. אבות עטרה לבנים.
I think I also once saw an English version.
At about page 236 in the first note are some descendants of R Heilprin and some more family.
https://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=46893&st=&pgn...=

I'm not certain where exactly where the problem is but I have typed in Hebrew part of that footnote below.
ר' צבי הירש ז"ק אשתו מ' דינה בת הג"מ ר' אליעזר ליפמן אבד"ק חעלמא בןהג"מ ר' ישראל היילפרין אבד"ק קראטאשין בן הג"מ ר' אליעזר ליפמן היילפרין בן (..?) ר' משה היילפרין מבריסק דליטא בן הר"ר זבולון אליעזר
It also has information about other wives in the framily.

My research was more connected to the Sherseshevsky family listed on that page but some generations later. They are supposed to connect to my family but I have not discovered how.

If you need an English version or help with the rest of the footnote tell me.

I hope this helps.
Please keep me informed.

I hope you succeed.
Daniel

Thanks Daniel. From what I gather in the footnote, the two, Zvulen and Zevulon are the same person and may be merged once the issue of the spouse(s) of his son Moshe is resolved (which the footnote, from what I can see, does not address) Kevin Lawrence Hanit AND Claudia Bullock

Private User,

R' Moshe Heilprin (Maharsha father-in-law) appears to have been a great grandfather of R' Isaac Halpern, A.B.D. Tykocin. This is what I meant when I said that the same woman (Esther) could not have been married to both men.

Following the link from the Esther #2 profile https://www.jewishgen.org/webtrees/individual.php?pid=I1116&ged...
the interactive chart for David Halpern's ancestors provides a nice visual depiction of how Moshe's father Zevulon was the same generation as the Meir of Padua.

It also shows us that just as R' Isaac Halpern, A.B.D. Tykocin was a great-grandson of Zevulons son R' Moshe Heilprin (Maharsha father-in-law), Jacob Shor was a great grandson of the Meir of Padua's son Samuel Yehuda. And we can see that the daughter of Jacob Shor (3rd great grand-child of the Meir of Padua) married Rabbi Eliezer Lippman Heilprin, A.B.D. of Tarnogrod (3rd great grandson of Rabbi Zevulun Eliezer Heilprin)

Now, as you can see R' Moshe's Halprin lineage does not connect up with the Katzenellenbogen line of descent until the marriage of his 2nd great grandson to the daughter of Jacob Shor (who was a 2nd great granddaughter of Samuel Yehuda Katzenellenbogen. Consequently, the focus in UC is on the descendants of Jacob Shor's daughter and her husband R' Eliezer, although her Eliezer's father R' Isaac of Tykocin happens to be mentioned, and there is a footnote next to his name which refers us to sources for more information on Halperin family Ancestry:

footnote #64 from page 24 of Volume 3-
For the Halperin family see MLGO, 70, AEA and Horowitz, LTKP, 406. See also the memorial book on Stanislaw, with a Halpern family tree and the Pinsk-Karlin memorial book article by Z Rabinowitz of Haifa (Luria and Halpern families). For Isaiah his son, see LTKP, 530. Published sources list his children. Other sources have a rabbi-son who was ABD Klimontow (as opposed to Kreszow) and a rabbi-son, ABD Sikva while omitting a son Simon (information from a Lvov document, a copy of which is in possession of DovBerish Weber).

I don't entirely understand all of the abbreviations in the footnote, and maybe I need to figure them out. In any case, I hope having this extra information will be helpful to you.

Claudia

PS: I just found yet a third Zebulun with a whole line of descendants, all of whom can be merged: Rabbi Zevulun Eliezer Heilprin

Private User

From my perspective, the one you just found is actually the main one that resides in the main tree and connects in with the Halperin profiles that Kevin has been working on.

Claudia

Claudia Bullock But that third tree doesn't include all of Moshe ben Zebulun's offspring?!? Once all the mergers are done, I think someone is going to have to assume responsibility for MP-ing many of the Heilprin profiles because there are so many Heilprin descendants putting in their two cents that things are bound to foul up repeatedly.....Preferably this would be someone who is a Heilprin descendant, but if no one steps up, then an independent curator could play serve the role.

Private User,

The reason I said that the 3rd tree was the 'main' one from my perspective is that it represents what is coming out of Unbroken Chain, and it is a humongous tree that Kevin and I have been working on, and encompasses way, way, more than the Halperns who are part of it. If the other Zebulons are merged in, they will be getting merged into that larger tree which they are not now connected to. That is all I meant.

You are absolutely correct that the 3rd tree does not yet have all of Moshe ben Zebulon's offspring, which might be added through a merge, and that is understandable considering that this part of the Halpern family is not covered by the Unbroken Chain. The reason that Moshe ben Zebulon gets connected to this tree is because his 2nd great grandson married the daughter of Jacob Shor. There is a large branch of Halpern's covered by Unbroken Chain who are all descendants of Jacob Shor, and that is what is being worked through right now by Kevin Lawrence Hanit. That is where some error was introduced at some point. I think that trying to address issues related to Halperns that are not part of the Unbroken Chain, and are not ancestors of Halperns who are in the Unbroken Chain kind of goes beyond the scope of The Unbroken Chain project, because it deals with issues the book cannot address.

Claudia

Understood and thank you Claudia. Apropos the Maharam to Heilprin line please monitor this discussion: https://www.geni.com/discussions/206706 This may be of interest to you.

I am not completely following this discussion. However I saw something, which if you have not already seen, might be of interest to you. Otzar Hachochma has a book
נחלת משה מהדורת זכרון אהרן. Page 8 has a writeup on the family of משה היילפרין.
Daniel

Kevin Lawrence Hanit Are you addressing the three Zebulons? 1) Rabbi Zevulun Eliezer Heilprin, 2) Rabbi Zevulun Eliezer Heilprin, 3) Rabbi Zevulun Eliezer Heilprin. Seems that #1 should be the MP and the others plus their descending lines 'quarantined' pending further examination. The MP blurb could be more or less the same as for EL Heilprin.

Private User,

Profile #1 has been made into a MP. Profile 3 has been merged into it.

#2 may need to have a cut made in the path between him and the correct tree, but I can't figure it out at this time.

Here's the current path that we need to have a look at:

https://www.geni.com/path/Zebulun+is+related+to+R-Ezekiel-Katzenell...

Kevin

Thanks Kevin Lawrence Hanit #1-#2 merger is okay except I would still delete this profile from the son Moshe: ester (dauther of rabbi hirtz from stanow) Halpern (Segal) We have tried to substantiate the source (see discussion on her profile) for this spouse but there doesn't appear to be any evidence so she should be removed from here pending that evidence.

As for #2, a merger of individual profiles could be done between #1 and #2 up to Rabbi Eliezer Lippman Heilprin, A.B.D. of Tarnogrod; after that I don't know anything because I have not studied the Schor-K'bogen unions shown in the pathway you provided.Is there a problem with the Schor-K'bogen part?

CORRECTION: first line of prior post:"... #1-#3 merger is okay..."

Private User,

I've isolated the profile of ester (dauther of rabbi hirtz from stanow) Halpern (Segal) and her father. I will leave them isolated, so that Haim Katz - Hachoen Wartski can delete them himself.

Kevin

Kevin Lawrence Hanit
I deleted both profiles

Haim Katz - Hachoen Wartski,

Thanks for deleting them.

Kevin

I have downloaded an article that discusses different possibilities of the relation between Reb Moshe Heilprin & the Maharsa.
I can e-mail it to anyone interested.

Responded privately.