King David of Israel - GENI IS SHOWING TODAY'S JEWS LINKED TO KING DAVID THROUGH ARAB MONARCHS !!??

Randy Schoenberg here's one for you - Sheshet Perfet

The linked Wikipedia article shows a physician whose father's name is also known. Nothing else appears to be known of the family.

The Geni profile - and its attached parents, children and siblings - all appears to be either made up, or the result of bad merges.

Culprit does not seem to have realized that "ben" denotes the name of the person's father.

Erica Howton Jason Scott Wills Randy Schoenberg here's another excellent al'Andalus starting place - "Isaac the Jew", Charlemagne's Diplomat

Isaac the Jew was historical .Three primary (extant!) sources mention him. None of them mention any family at all.

Makhir of Narbonne (listed as Isaac's brother) was historical, but most of his supposed family is a tradition without specific details, or was made up by Arthur Zuckeman (who was a noted contraversialist) in the 1960s. There's no known connection between Makhir and Isaac the Jew.

To the best of my knowledge, any and all descendants of Isaac are fake.

Same possibly for any descendants of Makhir. ???? bat Makhir Natronai of Narbonne looks suspicious in particular.

This one's probably quite an easy fix (unlike my previous comment).

1. Isaac the Jew has no known parents, siblings or children.
2. Makhir has no known children (we can probably just leave Natronai as his father).

Time all these connections to biblical figures are removed until properly proven by sources not wishful speculation .
A very BIG job but desperately needed .

King David of Israel is your first cousin 27 times removed's husband's wife's father's wife's fourth great grandmother's husband's 6th great aunt's husband's third cousin 18 times removed's partner's father.

I do believe that to be not true .
Just like descendancy of biblical Adam and Eve either we all are their direct descendants or none of us are .

I just want to agree that these made-up profiles to biblical profiles are very damaging to the overall Geni brand. I reported a non-factual, non-specific, unsourced line last year but the manager steadfastly defended his work: Jewish families in Dalmatia and Ancient Salona, V - VI c. Such lines are patently ridiculous, and they wrongly give the impression that Geni isn't a credible genealogy site.

While fixing all the existing profiles will take time, surely there's a simple way to stop this problem getting worse? Just dont allow users to publish profiles pre-c1000 without approval by curators? (Approval being dependent on source checking & verification). 99% of all of our trees should be post-c1400 anyway, so this won't affect anyone but the chancers...

I am only versed in Judaism, but, when almost all the kings of Europe, and Muslim kings are the descendants of King David? Let me very much doubt it.

As for Jim Harlow, I do not know him, I read in the forums here that he fabricated things. I must point out, that the few times I checked profiles he opened, I did find verification.

In conclusion:
I have no doubt that the whole biblical tree, must undergo a comprehensive examination by people who really understand it, but it is not possible (in my opinion) that the profiles of one nation will be cut, while in other nations the profiles will remain as they are, even though we all know that most profiles are fake
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And so I express my protest, there are many who think like me but are afraid to express their opinion publicly, whoever knows me knows, that the only fear I have is from God, not from anyone else

Haim Wartski,Hachoen - Nation ? Now which nation would that be ?

" but it is not possible (in my opinion) that the profiles of one nation will be cut, while in other nations the profiles will remain as they are, "

My grandmother had to flee Europe 1939 for being too Jewish for some , so do I belong to which nation ? my atDNA says Iberian ! 3 Rabbis as ancestors myself and more than 800 Cohen/Cohn / Kohn atDNA relatives , 700 Lev/Levi / Levisson atdna relatives .

Martin Leo thank you ! --- Such lines are patently ridiculous, and they wrongly give the impression that Geni isn't a credible genealogy site.

J P Weyers
I do not understand your answer at all

I am happy to hear about every Jew who managed to escape from Europe ... Unfortunately, almost my entire family was murdered in the Holocaust

you find 3 rabbis who are your ancestors? , for me all my great-grandfathers were rabbis and about most of them learn in the history lessons of the people of Israel, and of course in the Bible.

In the DNA test you found relatives who are from Choanim's families, beautiful, I myself Choen son after son up to Aaron Hachoen...

What do you want to express "in your answer"?

Haim -- We are all a mixture of many nations , many religions and many races .
Modern DNA testing confirms this.
I have Jewish cousins ,Mennonite cousins ,Dutch Reformed cousins ,Lutheran cousins ,Muslim cousins all blood relatives.
My one Jewish cousin his grt grandmother the daughter of a Dutch Reformed minister. His grandmother my grandfather's sister . Yet I am Roman Catholic and he is Jewish.
We all one nation actually

I actually see more tolerance and acceptance of Abrahamic Religious roots or descendancy claims here on GENI than Nordic ,Germanic , Roman ,Greek or say Welsh gods descendancy claims.
For any person from any other Relgion , Abrahamic Religious books like the Torah, Bible or Quran are just mythical and fictitious as well.
That is freedom of religion.

-- also the " lost in translation " or lost in time problem with all Religious documents..Interpretations and scholarly divisions .

J P Weyers

Again, with all due respect and appreciation, I do not understand your answer
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There are different lines in Geni: Christian, Muslim, and Jewish,

Each line consists of different branches .... The current situation is
That only the Jewish branches are cut, while the rest of the lines remain as they are, and include thousands of fake profiles
There is no connection between the things I meant, and the fact that some of the families (including of course Jewish families) are mixed families.

By the way, I am a descendant of rabbinical families and dynasties, I did not find even one branch involved in my family Who left Judaism and assimilated, except the branch of Bustanai Ben Haninai (assuming the story about his two wives is true).

And one more thing: to write about things I wrote from the bottom of my heart: ridiculous things, it's insulting and hurtful, I will not let anyone hurt me or the memory of my family

Haim Katz - Hachoen Wartski they're saying that they're cleaning up everything, but they need people to point specific incorrect profiles out to them. Otherwise they'll have a hard time finding them.

I do want to note that people use this site for a variety of reasons.

Geni's TOS doesn't require gold standard genealogical evidence on all profiles - i.e. if we as a community start requiring two primary sources of evidence for each data point, what percent of all profiles on the site would meet that standard? 1%?

My gut feel here is that at the end of this process we are going to wind up with some relatively plausible lines to antiquity.

They're NOT going to meet that genealogical gold standard, but they're going to have some reasonably reliable secondary or teriary sources, and hopefully any obvious fabrications will have been removed.

That WILL conflict with what the "no lines to antiquity" project is trying to accomplish. But I'm pretty sure it will not conflict with Geni's TOS.

It's probably worth having some conversation about this sooner or later.

Jeremy Richard Lichtman - problem I believe is that a lot of individuals will not like or agree with what others might believe are plausible lines to antiquity.

The word " believe " is relevant here.

Why we have Religious and Racial intolerance and persecution.
Some always believe their version of the truth more correct than others .
Someone claims descendancy from Thor it is that persons believe and who will decide ?
How many different y-dna haplogroups direct to biblical David ? Can only be one!

Seems to me the main objections was being descendant of Biblical David via Arabs.
Whose families we very likely Jewish before 640 ade anyway.
DNA tests again also proof the relationship of most of the people in the Levant ,Syria ,Israel , and Saudi Arabia regardless of religious orientation.

I personally object to any pure race superiority or inferiority theory no matter whom is trying to perpetuate that myth.

Time might possiblly still proof this connection right and will everyone accept it then ? NO some will not .

J P Weyers You and I agree about mythical or euhemeristic profiles in deep antiquity.

I think where we probably disagree is in late antiquity.

I'm pretty sure we can show reasonable lines to the exilarchs/gaonim, and possibly some other lines.

Obviously those people had really good PR, so we can't necessarily reliably take the chain further back in time.

Jeremy Richard Lichtman ---- agree with you 99.999 % ?
One must just remember ancestors not restricted or regulated via religion or race. I know of too many instances disproving that theory.
Living in SA too often hear shock and denial when a " white " South African is confronted with Non -white or even Jewish ancestors ( yes that's too much to accept for them ).
No branch of their family was non- white or married a non European . Its a terrible lie.
Mine I know married every religion and every race on earth ; under no illusion. Converting as was nedded often for survival or love
But the truth is what it is and not always what one believes to be the truth.

J P Weyers I commented earlier on this thread.

The Arab line from from the original post on this thread is based on near contemporary sources. I don't have the expertise to evaluate those sources, but they're definitely plausible, and they seem to fit with what we know of marriage patterns from that era.

The separate line on Erica's tree appears to be an instance of a medieval Andalusian ruler hiring genealogists to prove descent from the Queen of Sheba. i.e. this is probably not a modern thing. It's obviously not correct, just based on the number of generations (looks to be off by roughly 1200 years). Given that it's likely an old tradition, it definitely falls into the "people will yell" category though.

Also: my extended family resembles the UN General Assembly.

Private User

As you know, my family tree is for the purpose of commemorating both my parents and my family members many of whom were murdered in the Holocaust.

I chose Geni to establish the family tree...
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As a person who is constantly searching for the truth (and the curators I work with can attest to that), I get upset about any forgery that people fake.

I of course differentiate between mistakes that people make in good faith (it is very possible that I was wrong too), and fakes ... but, I also get upset about unbalanced policies
It is not possible for very many generations and thousands of profiles in one nation (Jews) to be cut, while in other nations, where there are tens of thousands of fake profiles, everything will remain as it is including the fakes.
Therefore, people and curators can write me that the policy is uniform, I judge things only when they are done, and here I see a jarring inconsistency

Hillel Hazaken - 'The Elder', President, The Sanhedrin is my 9th great aunt's 57th great grandfather.
King David of Israel is my second great grandfather's wife's father's wife's 89th great grandfather.

Haim Wartski,Hachoen - I am impressed and respect what you are doing on GENI .
Commendable .
Honoring your parents and searching for the truth .
Some small way I am trying to do the same at last being able not to hide my non-european ancestors and Jewish ancestors . Still get nasty responses but looking forward and proud of my ancestors .
I am not descendant of at first glance impressive ancestors like you.
However I am proud of all of them > Slaves , Slave owners , witches burned at the stake or hung ( 2 Koppel actually converted Jews stiil trying celebrating Friday night , accused of performing rituals ) , Rabbis , Imams , Ministers , wealthy traders and poor labourers , some Kings , Queens and aristocracy , some just a name ANNA ? nothing else about her.

About being disconnected from ancient Biblical ancestors , Shmuel Khan have enlightened me about challengers and problems they face on GENI .

Suddenly the shekel dropped !
Remove some connections and face an angry mob Thinking Salman Rushdie and Charlie Hebdo .
Hope your search for your ancestors are fruitfull and give you and your family joy .

J P Weyers

First, I thank you for your warm words.

Second thing
No one should be ashamed of his family (except of course descendants of the Nazis and whoever helped them murder - for that, I will never forgive, !!!!!!!!, descendants of murderers, etc.) ... My parents educated me that every job honors its owner, Provided it is a lawful employment,

Erica Howton

I was already thinking of leaving the subject, but your words insulted me
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No one (nor the curator ) should write to me how I should feel or write ... I am a paid customer at Geni and have contributed a lot to the general tree at geni, so I ask you to stop and dictate to me what I should do !!! I am a mature person, and do not need anyone's advice