Dame Katherine Elizabeth Hawkins (Gonson) - issue of sir admiral john hawkins

Thank you for that information

Some sources say it's not quite that straightforward. Admiral Sir John Hawkins had no children in wedlock at all. (Admiral) Richard was a "woods colt" whose mother may or may not have been Katherine Gonson, and Sir John may have married her with the intent of legitimating Richard (assuming she *was* his mother).

Middle names were *extremely* rare in Elizabethan times, and when (or if) found are double-barrelled women's first names (Mary Ann, Sarah Jane) or commemorate some extraordinary family event (Thomas Postumus - there were at least two posthumous Thomases in different families).

(Admiral Sir) Richard Hawkins described Dame Katherine Gonson as his "stepmother", for whatever that's worth.

We need to watch out *very very carefully* for people who want to hang stray Hawkinses on this family tree - it is always happening, and usually creates a great big mess that takes ages to sort out again.

I am going by historical records, such as copies of wills.katherine goson biography according to excecolpedias states they were married 32 years,and ,she died in 1591 and Richard's birthdate is listed as,jan.13,1605. records states Katherine and sir john are listed as marrying in 1557 or 1559. i'm just trying to find correct information,there is so much contradiction on all the sites. where does sir Richard state dame Katherine as his stepmother? thanks, vivian

For starters I think you have the wrong Richard. The Admiral's dates are c. 1560-late April 1622.

The "stepmother" quote is from his "Observations" (i.e. memoirs), a comment in passing. He had a ship built in late 1588 and wrote this about it: "The day of her launching being appointed, the Lady Hawkins (my step-mother) named her the Repentance...." (He disliked the name, and got the Queen to rename it the "Dainty".) http://welbank.net/hawkins/pah/chap5.html

I notice somebody has attached a "Thomas Hawkins" as a "brother" - he looks suspiciously like a duplicate of Admiral Sir Richard, complete with s Hele wife and a daughter Johanna. The line goes nowhere, however.

His "descendants" have also been fracked with - he had two sons (John and Richard) and four daughters, the eldest of whom (by some eleven years) was named Judith. (He spent about a decade in a Spanish prison.)

The tree was nice and clean at one point, and then along came the barnacles - again and again and again. There's a particular "Richard Hawkins" who keeps getting Crazy-Glued on because Americans can't accept that no Hawkins who went to America can be traced back to the Admiral.

Maven, if you point out the guy who keeps getting re-attached, I'll cut and relationship lock. I'm a Hawkins descendant myself. My notes don't go back to the Admiral so I'd like to get your recommendation about where to break the line.

Will of Sir Richard Hawkins

IN the name of God Amen the 16th day of April 1622 in the twentieth yeare of the raigne of our Sorraigne Lord James by the Grace of God Kinge of England Fraunce and Ireland Defender of the Faith and of Scotland the fyve and fyftith I Sir Richard Hawkins of Slapton in the Countye of Devon Knight beinge sicke and weake in bodye but of pfect mynde and memory blessed be God therefore doe hereby make ordayne and declare this to be my last will and Testament in manner and forme followinge. First and principalle I commend my soule unto Almightie God my Maker Redeemer and Sanctifier hoping and beleeving assuredly that through the only merritts death and resurrection of Jesus Christ I shall obtayne full and free remission and pardon of all my sinnes and be made ptaker of eternall life and happiness in the kingdome of heaven with God's elect for ever. And I comitt my body to the earthe from whence it came and after my bodye buried my will and minde is that all suche debts as I shall owe to any p'son or p'sons at the tyme of my decease be first well and trulie satisfied

And touching the orderinge and disposinge of all such lands grounds tenements goods and chattells as it hathe pleased Almightie God to blesse mee with in this life I give and bequeathe the same in manner and forme following Item I give unto Judith my well beloved wife (for and duringe the terme of her natural life) all that my Mannor or Lordshipp of Poole in the Parishe of Slapton in the County of Devon with all mills lands grounds messuages cottages tenements and hereditaments with their and every of their appurtennes to the said Mannor or Lordshipp of Poole now belonging or in any wise app'teyninge And likewise I give and bequeath unto the said Judith my wife (for and duringe the tearme of her naturall life) all other my lands and tenements cottages and hereditaments with the appertennes situate lyeinge and being in or about Plymouth in the Countye of Devon Neverthelesse and uppon this condition followeinge tbat she shall yearelye duringe soe longe tyme as my sonne John Hawkins shall remaine and dwell with his said mother allowe and paie unto my said sonne twentie pounds per annum of lawfull money of England And if it shall happen that he shall hereafter be minded to lyve from her and betake himself to some other place of aboade or otherwise to travaile or to betake himself to lyve either at the Innes of Courte or at the universities of Oxford or Cambridge then to paie unto my said sonne John and his assignes during all such time as hee shall live from her as aforesaid the yearlie some of fortie pounds of lawfull money of England at fower of the most usual feests or termes in the yeare by even and equall por'cons Item I give and bequeath ymediatlie from and after the decease of my said wife Judith all the said Mannor howse or Lordship called Poole with all mills lands grounds messuages cottages tenements and hereditaments with the ire and every of theire appurten'ces in the Parish of Slapton and all other my said lands tenements cottages and hereditaments with th'app'tences lyeinge and being in or about Plymouth in the County of Devon af~resaid with the reverc'on and rever'cons thereof unto my said sonne John Hawkins with all and singular my goods chattells utensils and household stuffe whatsoever Provided always that my said wife may have and enjoy use occupie and possesse the same goods and chattells 'during her life without any interup'con or lett of my said sonne John or of any others by his pcurement Item I give and bequeathe to my sonne Richard Hawkins and to his heires for ever all that messuage or tenement with th'app'tences called Pryvitt scituate lyeinge and being in Alverstoke in the Countye of Southt with all lands and grounds thereunto belonginge or in any wise apperteyninge

Item I give and bequeathe to Margaret Hawkins my daughter (over and above a hundred pounds legacie given her by her grandmother and a jewell of twentye pound value) the some of one hundred pounds of lawfull money of England Item I give and bequeathe to my daughter Joane Hawkins one hundred and twenty pounds and to my youngest daughter Mary the like some of one hundred and twentye pounds All which said three severall legacies of somes of money by me given unto my said three daughters as afforesaide I will shal be paid them at sixteene yeares of age or daye of marriage which shall first happen and to be receaved and had out of my owne entertaynmt due to me from the King's Ma'tie for my last service and imployment don by me at Argeire And if any of my said daughters shall happen to decease or dep'te this transitorie lyfe before they shall happen to come or attayne to their severall ages of sixteene yeares or daye of marriage as aforesaid then I will that the parte and porc'on of any of them so dyeinge or deceasinge as aforesaide shall remayne and come unto the others surviving and overlyving p'te and p'te alike by even and equall por'cons also for the further advancement and encrease of my said daughters porcons as aforesaide I doe equallie give to amongst my said daughters the some of one hundred and fiftie pounds due to me by Sir Henry Thynn Knight to be paid them when and so soone as my Executrix hereafter named shall happen to recover and receave the same And I make and ordayne the said Judith my lovinge wife sole and only Executrix of this my last Will and Testament and I renounce and revoke all former Wills by me formerly made In witness whereof I the said Sir Richard Hawkins have here- unto sett my hand and seale the said sixteenth day of Aprill 1622 in the twentieth yeare of the raigne of our said Soveraigne Lord King James over England France and Ireland
RICHARD HAWKINS
Sealed and delyvered in the presence of us Thos Button Jo Gifford Josias Shute and Robert Holyland Sr

Proved June 13th 1622, by Dame Judith Hawkins.

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Thus,

* John Hawkins (elder son)
* Richard Hawkins (younger son - the one most often messed with)
* Margaret Hawkins
* Joane Hawkins
* Mary Hawkins

Daughter Judith is not mentioned, which can be taken to mean either that she was well provided-for in marriage (the three others were none of them as old as sixteen) or had predeceased her father.

Justin, I'm afraid it's a Bad-Merge, which requires more work than a simple removal. And it's been Bad-Merged for years - we went all over this, got the Virginia Richard separated from the Devon Richard, got them all disentangled - and then person or persons unknown came along and tangled them all back up again. And again.

Son John has also been barnacled with a bogus wife - he had one and only one wife, Hester Richards of Dartmouth. Their children:
* Judith
* Hester (1)
* Richard
* John (1643-1670, d.s.p.)
* William
* Hester (2)
* Robert
* Mary
* Thomas
* Nicholas

Son Richard (of Devon) is known to have married an Elizabeth somebody (maybe a Drake, maybe not - one would think *that* would have been mentioned) and had three children, Elizabeth, Nicholas, and Jeremiah.

The Richard Hawkins (of Virginia) who married Grace Cutland is no known relation.

Oh, and John Hawkins had no middle name - "Sidney" seems to belong to a later John Hawkins, or to have been pulled out of someone's ear.

I'm working mainly from http://welbank.net/hawkins/pah/chap7.html, which has the decency to cite primary sources when they can be found.

Something interesting has come up in re Admiral Sir Richard's wife Judith. It has been assumed since forever that she was the daughter of Thomas Hele, Sheriff of Devon c1601 - but it turns out there is a hole in the evidence. Thomas had a daughter Judith, who married *a* Hawkins - but his first name is not given. (Vivian's composited Visitations of Devon, pp. 465-466)

I ask you, is that the least bit plausible if she had married someone as famous as Admiral Sir Richard Hawkins?

OK. Let me know when you're done with the cleanup and ready for one of us to lock.

Justin, I didn't really want to get dragged back into this project, since *I* was the one who invested days and days to get it all unmessed in the first place, only to see it get all messed up again in very short order.

Here's a fine example of how badly it gets messed AND how far up the messing reaches: Thomas Hawkins has been Bad-Locked to Adm. Sir John Hawkins, who was almost certainly not his father. He has only one "supporting" source, and that one is the unreliable Wikitree.

There is rather obviously a Bad Assumption involved, namely that the Johanna Hawkins who married John Pinney and emigrated to Massachusetts "must" have been a descendant of the famous Hawkins famiy. It ain't so - she's not even from the same County. They're Devon, she's Somerset (Broadway, Somersetshire, England, to be precise). http://www.familycentral.net/index/family.cfm?ref1=3712:3838&re... Johanna has parents Blocked at this site, and it's perfectly obvious why - to keep fools from reattaching her to the famous Hawkinses.

Her father may or may not have been named Thomas (no reliable sources, so far) but he was *not* a son of Admiral Sir John Hawkins. Period.

As for Joan Hele, daughter of Sheriff Thomas Hele, she's real enough, but she didn't marry any Hawkins. Vivian's compilation/continuation says that she married Robert Rolle of Heampton and was living as of 1652 (Vivian, pp. 464 and 466). Link to free edition at Google Books may or may not be reliable: https://books.google.com/books/about/The_Visitations_of_the_County_...

By the way, the Hawkins family seems *not* to have been armigerous prior to the father-and-son Admirals. Hawkinses appear in the Visitations only when one of them marries into an armigerous family.

I have sir Richard and son john correct and was trying to find correct information because I had seen incorrect information on Richard, I guess the stuff you are talking about ,I had read his will you posted also. I have not added oe removed anything. thanks maven for your clear and backupped information. vivian

@ Richard Hawkins, I have information correct on Richard and his son john, but was trying to verify information I had seen about Richard, the stuff you are talking about.i had read his will also. thank you maven for your correct information with back up information. I have not added or removed any information. thanks vivian

Mixed up Judith and Joan Hele. There is enough of a pattern match between the wills of Thomas Hele (Sheriff of Devon 1600-1601) and of Judith Hele Hawkins to confirm that Judith probably is his daughter. Which makes it all the odder that her husband is not more specifically named - maybe Thomas had taken a dislike to him.

Let me know if you need Curator tools to fix, Maven