Colonel Robert Pitt, I - Mash-Merged?

This is what I found on GENI.about Col.Robert Pitt.
Colonel Robert Pitt, I is your 6th great grandfather.
Jerry
→ Junie Day Prater
your mother → Mary Ann Salmons
her mother → William Thomas Pitts
her father → Jonathan Johnathan Pitts
his father → Andrew Pitts
his father → John Pitts
his father → Henry Pitt
his father → Colonel Robert Pitt, I
his father share this path

Colonel Robert Pitt, I MP
Gender: Male
Birth: March 16, 1607
Bristol, City of Bristol, England, United Kingdom
Death: January 9, 1674 (66)
Isle of Wight County, Virginia, Colonial America
Immediate Family:
Son of William Thomas Pitt, II and Mary Marlowe Pitt
Husband of Martha Pitt; Martha Pitt; Hester Pitt and Martha Pitt
Father of Elizabeth Norsworthy; Robert Pitt, II; Martha Pitt; John Pitt, Lt. Col.; Mary Brasseur; Hester Bridger; John Pitt; Henry Pitt; Martha Pitt; Lt. Colonel John Pitt, I; James Pitt and William Pitt « less
Brother of William Pitt, III; Mary Newell; Capt. Henry Pitt; Anne Pitt; Thomas Pitt; Maud Pitt and Martha Pitt « less
Added by: Emily Dunn on May 18, 2008
Managed by: Bjørn P. Brox and 39 others
Curated by: Dan Cornett

Jerry: This discussion is *on* Geni ... there's no need to post a lot of data from here. Just post a link to a profile if you think it is relevant.

Now let's try to find out something we *don't* already know....

The first of the Parliamentary Pitts was John Pitt of Bridport http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1604-1629/member/pi..., who stood for Bridport in 1604. He had no children, and his next nearest Parliamentary relative was his nephew Matthew Pitt http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1604-1629/member/pi... (2nd son of a Richard Pitt who must have been John Pitt's brother).

Their relationship to Sir William Pitt (c.1559-1636) http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1604-1629/member/pi... isn't clear. What is clear is that Edward Pitt http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1604-1629/member/pi... was the oldest son of William. (A younger son was another William, but no other members of this family sat in Parliament in this generation.)

This site suggests an ancestry of Dorset mariners & merchants, and of the Pitt line that produced the PM. So looking at his tree may assist

http://www.genealogy.com/ftm/m/e/d/Brenda-Gail-Medley/WEBSITE-0001/...

On September, 1631 Robert Pitt, son of William Pitt, merchant, qualified for
freedom and admittance to the Merchant Society, Bristol, England where he
lived.He was descended from the same Pitt ancestry in England that pro-
duced another William Pitt, Earl of Chatham, and who at one time was
Prime Minister of England. Alfred, Lord Tennyson, the famous English poet,
also was in the same line of descent.

When his mother died in 1634, five of her eight children went to America.
Robert Pitt went to Isle of Wight, Virginia.Robert was not a poor farmer when
he came to Virginia.He was a wealthy young man.

http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1754-1790/member/pi...

William Pitt the Elder, 1st Earl of Chatham, Prime Minister

(try the ancestor report from the Geni profile)

I only trust Internet trees (and that includes genealogy.com trees) to the extent that they can be verified. Brenda's tree has a yowler, did you notice? William "Blithe" Pitt, at a time when middle names were not only Not A Thing, they were contrary to canon law (this was pre-Reformation).

I suspect a lot of cutting and pasting pastward of Nicholas.

Miles Files cites this source (but no details): Mark C. Lewis, Mark C. Lewis Genealogy Research Files, William & Mary College Quarterly, Vol. 7, pp 225, 227, 237, 238. MK Miles was only interested in the family members that had anything to do with the Eastern Shore, so the tree is rather sketchy.

Various Pitts are also found all over the Isle of Wight County Records, in The William and Mary Quarterly, Volume 7, first series (available via Google: https://books.google.com/books?id=PyUjAQAAIAAJ&q=Pitt#v=snippet... )

Pp. 237-238 sketch out the first immigrant generations.

Still not much to say about Pitt ancestry except that Robert and Henry were sons of William Pitt and Mary Pitt, of Bristol; grandfather Thomas made his will in May 1613. They *may* be offshoots of the Parliamentary Pitts, but before they got involved with Parliament at all.

Speaking of Thomas Pitt's will, here it is:

http://gen.julianlyon.com/1613-thomas-pitt-of-bristol/

1613 Thomas Pitt of Bristol
11-0122-108_ThomasPitt-Bristol_1613

In the name of God Almighty, I THOMAS PITT of the City of Bristol merchant being in good health and of perfect memory I do humbly thank God for it do now this first day of May in the eleventh year of the reign of our Sovereign Lord King James of England etc and in the year of our Lord one thousand six hundred and thirteen [1/5/1613] do make this my last will and testament in manner hereafter following; first I bequeath and commend my soul to Almighty God my creator, to Jesus Christ my redeemer, and to the Holy Ghost the sanctifier of me and of all mankind being bold upon his promise, that in his mercy he will accept of me and all those which his son Christ Jesu shall present unto him unto whose protection I humbly commend myself both body and soul and after my decease my body to the earth and for my temporal goods and lands which God has lent me my will is I do give grant and bequeath unto my son WILLIAM PITT one lease for the term of his natural life of my tenement without Temple Gate within the liberty of the City of Bristol which is now in the possession of George Tyce innholder which tenement is called by the name of the Saracens Head with all stables backside and whatsoever is now in the possession of the said George Tyce and also I do give unto my said son William Pitt one lease for the term of his natural life of the tenement which I lately built without Temple Gate within the liberty of the said City of Bristol which is now in the occupation of Thomas Arthur Esquire together with all orchards gardens fish pool and all the grounds there with appurtenances to me the said Thomas Pitthe the said William Pitt yielding and paying unto ROBERT PITT the son of my said son William Pitt the sum of ten pounds yearly after the said Robert Pitt shall accomplish the age of twenty and two years and from thence forwards the said rent of ten pounds of lawful money of England to be paid to the said Robert Pitt by my said son William Pitt every year during the natural life of my said son William Pitt and after my said son William’s decease my will is and I do give grant and bequeath my said two tenements viz. the tenement called the Saracens Head now in the possession of George Tyce and the new tenement now in the possession of Thomas ArthurEsquire with all their appurtenances to them belonging as orchards gardens fish pool and grounds belonging to me the said Thomas Pitt unto Robert Pitt the son of my said son William Pitt and to the heirs of his body lawfully for ever in fee simple and for want of such heirs then my will is that the said two tenements with the orchards gardens grounds fish pool and whatsoever unto them belongeth shall remain and be to the heirs of my said son William Pitt for ever in fee simple my desire is that my said son William Pitt shall give unto his said sons WILLIAM PITT and Robert Pitt the sum of ten pounds apiece when they shall accomplish the age of sixteen years apiece to dispose thereof at the will and pleasure of the said William and Robert, my said son William Pitt giving unto his said sons William and Robert good counsel for the belonging thereof which if they or any of them will not be ruled by his counsel then he shall detain that his said gifts until they have more wit. ITEM; I give and bequeath to my daughter ALICE NORTHEN one silver gilt ale cup and to her the said Alice Northen the sum of forty pounds of lawful money of England to be paid to her or her assigns within two years after my decease and in the mean time my will is that my executor shall pay unto her or to her assigns the sum of four pounds every year for the use thereof which forty pounds when she has received to bestow upon her children at her will and pleasure. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my daughter ANNE MERRICK one silver gilt ale cup and my desire is that my son William Pitt will within eight months after my decease pay unto my son in law JOHN MERRICK the sum of twenty pounds of lawful money of England which said sum of twenty pounds my desire is to have it to be equally divided between my daughter Anne Merrick’s three children viz. to ANN WATERS MARY WATERS and ROBERT MERRICK and to the survovors of them. ITEM; I give unto my daughter MARY OWEN a silver gilt ale cup and my desire is that my son William Pitt will within eight months after my decease pay unto my son in law ROBERT OWEN the sum of twenty pounds of lawful money of England which said sum of twenty pounds my desire is to have it to be equally divided between my daughter Mary Owen’s three children viz. ROBERT OWEN MARY OWEN and JOANE OWEN and to the survivors of them. ITEM; I give unto my cousin Mr MATHEW HAVYLAND Alderman a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my kinsman WILLIAM PITT draper a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my kinsman EDWARD BATTEN a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my friend Mr Samuell Davies the sum of twenty shillings to preach my funeral sermon. ITEM; I give unto Mr George Baldwin my good friend a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath to my son in law John Merrick a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath to my son in law Robert Owen a ring of gold to the value of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath to Mistress Mary Slye widow the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto Charitie White the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my daughter in law MARY MARLOWE the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my daughter in law CICELY GUNNING the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my daughter in law ELIZABETH BATTERTON the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto my kinswoman MARY ROBINSON the sum of ten shillings for a token. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto the poor on this side Avon the sum of twenty shillings. ITEM; I do forgive my son THOMAS PITT all the debts he owes me by account or bonds upon condition that he does not charge my executor with any account of and for his demand and not otherwise; and whereas I have a grant of the [Surveys] of the City’s lands under their hands of the tenements upon the back now in the tenure of my son in law John Merrick in fee farm for which I and my heirs is to pay twenty shillings the year to the Mayor and Commonalty of the City of Bristol my will is that the fee farm shall be made over unto my said son William Pitt and to his heirs for ever at the rent of twenty shillings the year which is the old rent of the said tenements. All other my lands and goods unbequeathed I give unto my said son William Pitt and to his heirs for ever. And I do make him the said William Pitt the executor of this my last will and testament and I do make my trusty friend and neighbour Thomas Callowhill the overseer of this my last will and testament and desire him to give counsel unto my said executor and I do give him twenty shillings to make him a ring of gold. ITEM; I give and bequeath to my servant Fortune Pentygrace the sum of twenty shillings. ITEM; I give and bequeath unto John Fyne the sum of five shillings. In witness whereof I have set to my hand and seal the aforesaid day being the first day of May AD 1613 – by me Thomas Pitt – witness to this will: William Pitt – Thomas Callowhill

Proved 5th August 1613 by William Pitt, natural son and executor

Some of the verbiage is antiquated - "daughter in law" could also mean "stepdaughter", and "natural son" did not carry the stigma of bastardy that it does now.

Oh by the way I do NOT think he was Thomas Pitt of Blandford m. Priscilla Searle - Priscilla apparently survived her husband, and the Thomas who wrote the will was apparently a widower - no wife mentioned. (The "daughters in law" may be a hint that his wife - or one of them - was a widow with children from previous marriage.)

The sons in law clearly *are* just that, as they are named and associated with his daughters. The "daughters-in-law" are a little less specific - son William was specified as married with two sons (Robert and another William), but the only other son he mentions is a Thomas who was apparently something of a deadbeat.

Mary "Marlowe" might be William's wife, or she might be a stepdaughter who (may have) married a Marlowe.

It's rather obvious that William Pitt is a mash-merge: there was a son William AND a son Thomas, but no "William Thomas". And that picture is The Hon. William Pitt the Younger (the Earl of Chatham's second son).

So we have:
Thomas Pitt, of Bristol (d. c. 1613) no wife
Son 1: William Pitt, w/2 sons, Robert and William
Son 2: Thomas, deadbeat
Daughter Alice Northern m. NN Northern, unspecified "children"
Daughter Anne Merrick m. John Merrick, 3 adult children: Ann Waters, Mary Waters, Robert Merrick.
Daughter Mary Owen m. Robert Owen, 3 children: Robert, Mary, Joane
Cousin Mathew Havyland
Kinsman William Pitt, draper (which William?)
Kinsman Edward Batten
friend Samuel Davies
friend George Baldwin
Mistress Mary Slye, widow (10s token)
Charitie White (10s token)
"daughter in law Mary Marlowe" (10s token)
"daughter in law Cicely Gunning" (10s token)
"daughter in law Elizabeth Batterton" (10s token)
Kinsman Mary Robinson (10s token)
The poor this side of Avon (20s)
friend & neighbor Thomas Callowhill, 20s and a gold ring, to oversee will
servant Fortune Pentygrace (20s)
John Fyne (5s)

I should think that if Mary Marlowe were son William Pitt's wife, she would have been left rather more than a 20-shilling pittance. Thomas Pitt was quite lavish with William, William's sisters, and William's sisters' husbands and children (except NN Northern, who isn't even mentioned and may have been deceased).

Several sources say the Thomas Pitt who m. Priscilla Searle was born c. 1567 and d. 1643, which puts him rather later than Thomas Pitt of Bristol - and indicates a cut-and-paste job on William to Crazy-Glue him to the Parliamentary Pitts.