Sir Roger Corbet, Kt. - The Corbet Mess and the Visitations of Shropshire

Maria Lacon

The difficulty with the "Corbet-72" chart is that it's only half the family. It's missing the Caus and Moreton sides - there was another chart for that side, which needs to be found and checked. (It may NOT help resolve the Moreton mess, because it was *only very recently* that it was realized HOW badly the Visitations of Shropshire were messed up.)

But yeah, the Corbets had been branching out for quite some time - Staffordshire, Cheshire, Leicestershire, Worcestershire, and supposedly even Scotland ( a "lost" branch based on one guy who kept going Oop North till he found someplace he liked).

Different ? I cant find Agnes as a daughter

Sir William Boothe, Kt., of Dunham and

Wikipedia on Acton Burnell: "It is supposed that Roger, the Domesday tenant of Actune, was ancestor of those Burnels, from whom afterwards the manor took its distinctive title of Acton Burnell." Maybe, maybe not - Roger may have sublet it to a Burnell (in his entourage?). The whole subject of Burnell ancestry gets very complicated, tangled up with the Benthalls, and completely unsolvable by reference to the messed-up Visitations. Eyton is some help, and the primary records he points to are even more help, but there are points that will probably remain forever foggy.

Sir William Boothe, Kt., of Dunham

Agnes' John Corbet was http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1509-1558/member/co... - parents Thomas son of Peter of Lye, and Jane Kynaston. This source also names her father as "William Booth of Dunham, Cheshire", but without the "Sir". (He does not seem to have sat in Parliament, or maybe was Potholed.)

With that large a kaboodle of kids, it wouldn't be surprising if one or more daughters got overlooked.

Visitations of Cheshire are much better than Shropshire, but they still sometimes miss the occasional daughter or wife.

Shaw comes through on William Booth: knighted circa 1497 "in Scotland by George, Lord Strange, being there with Thomas earl of Surrey" (vol. II p. 32) with eight others.

Now what was going on in Scotland in 1497 that required a small army? Repelling one of those semi-annual border incursions?

The "Earl of Surrey" was Thomas Howard, later 2nd Duke of Norfolk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Howard,_2nd_Duke_of_Norfolk, who had his son (still later the 3rd Duke) along with him. Lord Strange was the "King's Lieutenant" and had been deputized by Henry VII to conduct any necessary knightings - he seems to have seen fit to hand out a whole bunch (pp. 31-32).

Found the chart for Caus and Moreton, and sure enough it's messed up at exactly the same points the Visitations of Shropshire are messed up. Guess where she got her (mis)information. https://www.wikitree.com/photo.php/6/60/Corbet-163.jpg

Now what I am wondering is who is the Roger Corbet who shows up at the top of Bartrum's tree.

Reminder -- http://cadair.aber.ac.uk/dspace/bitstream/handle/2160/6360/CORBET%2...

It isn't the one married to Nest de Valle, because Bartrum is very careful about putting in women's names when known, AND the siblings don't match.

But Bartrum considers him the top of the Corbet tree, as far as the Welsh are concerned.

Ah.

Bartrum has gone to the wall.

The Peter up at the top of this page
http://cadair.aber.ac.uk/dspace/bitstream/handle/2160/6361/CORBET%2...

Is, theoretically, the same as this Peter

Peter Corbet, of Leigh

But things are not matching.

That's the problem - there are several conflicting versions of how the Corbet family came across to England and settled in Shropshire in the first place. Some of the versions involve a possibly mythical "Thomas the Pilgrim" who supposedly went off on Crusade and stayed away so long he was thought to be dead - and when he returned he found his younger brother had taken over, so he graciously moved off to greener pastures. (There's a similar, even more dramatic legend in a different family, but I can't remember which one offhand.)

(Anne:) Getting nothing. I think the site is down again. :-(

Or maybe it's the thunderstorm raging here.

In the meantime, having meandered into the Baker's from the Corbets, Roland Baker and I did some cleaning up in the Baker line, which was sorely needed. In the process, we detached Joan Baker Stowe from Sir John Baker, MP, Speaker of the House of Commons, parentage is incorrect and her parents are not known. Thus we severed MY path to the Corbets and the reason I had originally curated Sir Roger. But never fear, I have another direct path to Sir Roger (of course).

https://www.geni.com/path/Hatte-Blejer+is+related+to+Sir-Roger-Corb...

Joan Stowe

Private User - I'm going to take up your Swiss cheese approach, it's how I learn best too. I wonder where to start? The Norman Invasion?

I left at least one dangling person. Another Kynaston.

Isabella Charlton She was all mixed up in the Corbet / Charlton trees and didn't fit correctly. I haven't found her place yet.

@Maven-- Cadair is usually down on weekends. How they get studying done over there I do not know. It will come back.

@Haytte-- the beauty of the Swiss Cheese approach is that it defies logic. So my advice is, pick the thing that interests you the most.

I go for whatever I most don't understand. Until recently that was the Cousins War. Now, I totally get it.

I think the issue is the two Peter Corbet's?

Peter Corbet, of Leigh vs Peter Corbet, of Leigh

The first is cross referenced from Ormerod, Brereton pedigree

https://archive.org/stream/historyofcountyp03orme#page/51/mode/1up

The second from Bartrum

The names of their wives are suspiciously similar and have been fudged into "Alice Elizabeth" which I have trouble with.

Bartrum matches "magic chart" and gives the son who married Jane Kynaston.

Ormerod gives a son who doesn't match "magic chart."

Suggestions?

Burke follows Ormerod for Brereton

https://books.google.com/books?id=K3MaAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA74&lpg=...

Hal Bradley asking in 2002 about lineage for the Peter Corbet of Cheshire. Our gal Augusta EB Corbet of the Magic Chart invoked; and Problematic Ela tagged as introducing the Peter name into the Corbet tree

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/GEN-MEDIEVAL/2002-12/...

Kay Allen's answer to Hal Bradley's question:

-----

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/GEN-MEDIEVAL/2002-12/...

Peter is the son of Thomas C. and his Valletorte wife. I also have only two
Johns between Alice and Peter.

Alice was sister of Richard, who was son of John and this John was a son of yet
another John. Peter d. 1300. His son John d. 1348.The second John's death date
is unknown, and Alice d. after 1410.

----

Now to figure which is which?

Yuck Burke is different

https://books.google.com/books?id=9mNHAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA263&ot...

Page 263 of A genealogical and heraldic dictionary of the landed gentry of Great Britain & Ireland for 1852 Sir Bernard Burke Colburn and Company, 1852 - Gentry

I'm going to text it in the next post

Roger Corbet, who appears to have received the honour of knighthood, for in the inquisition taken on his death in the nineteenth year of Richard II., 1396, he is styled " Sir Roger Corbet," of Leigh, and the title *' knight," is there added. His son,
Peter Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, was father of
Thomas Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, sheriff of Shropshire in the year 1127, whose son,
Thomas Corbet, Esq. *. to the Leigh estate, and was father of
Roger Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, who, by his wife, Maria, had issue,
Thomas Corbet, Esq. of Leigh. He m. Jane, dau. of Sir John Burleigh, Knt. of Bromscroft, co. Salop, and their son,
Peter Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, m. Elizabeth, dau. of Sir William Brereton, Knt. of Malpas. By this lady he had issue,
Thomas Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, who m. Jane, dau. of Sir Roger Kynaston, Knt. of Middle, and their son,
John Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, was Sheriff of Shropshire in 1526 Mr. Corbet was thrice married: 1st, to Joyce, sister of Sir John Packington, Knt.; 2ndly, to Margaret, dau. of Sir Thomas Blount, Knt.; and, lastly, to Agnes, dan. of William Booth, Esq. of Dunham. By his second wife he left issue,
WILLIAM Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, who m. Alice, dau. of Thomas Lacon, Esq. of Willcy, co. Salop, and was by his son,
Thomas Corbet, Esq. of Leigh, who m. Elinor, dnu. of Thomas Williams, Esq. of Willaston, in Shropshire, anil left a son and successor, ....

Hi everyone I just logged in briefly yesterday to do something for another Geni member and this discussion caught my eye which sent me off hunting for some original documents for all these Corbet's. I found some Inquisitions Post Mortem and Proofs of age for the Corbets of Moreton, Corbets of Leigh, and Corbets of Hadley. They mostly relate to the main male line for each family. I am working my way through adding them all and they can be found via the source tab.

Here's an immigrant Robert Corbett, of Weymouth

Yay Charlene Newport !