"Matachanna" "Cleopatra" Powhatan, (Sister of Pochontas) - Primary Sources

That is a very good question.my belief is that documentation ruls out everuthing.there is alot of hear say.but the proof is in the pudding.thank you for bringing this up it needs to be further carried out and documented.i agree with you 100%

Pocahontas's People: The Powhatan Indians of Virginia Through Four Centuries
By Helen C. Rountree
https://books.google.com.au/books?id=fUzd7LeJpjYC&pg=PA84

On page 84:

Pocahontas’s son, Thomas Rolfe, asked permission of the governor (required of all English subjects in those days) to go into Indian country to see “Opachankeno [sic] to whom he is allied and Cleopatra his mother’s sister.” Thanks to the burning of all of the colonial council's records of this period in the Civil War, we know no more than that; “Cleopatra” may or may not have been the Matachanna who was wife to the priest Uttamatomakin.

https://books.google.com/books?id=QDwkDwAAQBAJ&lpg=PA83&ots...

Uttamatomakin, also called Tomocomo

Brothers Among Nations: The Pursuit of Intercultural Alliances in Early ...
By Cynthia J. Van Zandt page 83

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomocomo

Little is known about Tomocomo's life before his visit to London. He appears to have met Captain John Smith during Smith's time in Virginia, since Smith says that in London they "renewed their acquaintance".[2] His wife, Matachanna, was Pocahontas's half-sister.[3]

3. David Price, Love and Hate in Jamestown (New York: Vintage, 2003), p. 164.

(link to the Price book) https://books.google.com/books?id=_EFbS_7fFcYC&lpg=PA298&vq...

He didn't go over well in London https://books.google.com/books?id=cdthjY43YeYC&lpg=PA17&ots...

Here Matachanna is described as Thomas Rofle's nanny also

https://books.google.com/books?id=cdthjY43YeYC&lpg=PA17&ots...

Europe's Indians, Indians in Europe: European Perceptions and Appropriations ...
By Dagmar Wernitznig page 13

Envisioning an English Empire: Jamestown and the Making of the North Atlantic World
Edited by Robert Appelbaum & John Wood Sweet

On page 59:

Another Powhatan who may have come to England and remained past 1617 is Tomocomo’s wife and Pocahontas’s sister, Matachanna, who could have been caring for Rolfes’ young son Thomas and may herself, like the youngster, have been too ill to return to Tsenacommacah in 1617. Perhaps she returned to Virginia a year or two later; there is no known burial in England, and her very presence in England is conjectural.

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=FPbSBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA59

An additional note on page 295:

"Matachanna's presence in England is not documented in the sources"

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=FPbSBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA295

So we don't know if Matachanna and Cleopatre (as named by Capt Smith) were the same person. In another English reference, Powhatan had "20 sons and 10 daughters"

Did you interpret Pocohantas accompanying maids, Mary & Elizabeth (who went to Bermuda) as her sisters? I didn't.

I didn't either.

Now I'm seeing a reference to Cleopatra, sister of Pocahantas, wife of Opechancanough, named for the The Tempest

https://books.google.com/books?id=cdthjY43YeYC&lpg=PA17&dq=...

Europe's Indians, Indians in Europe: European Perceptions and Appropriations ...
By Dagmar Wernitznig page 17

It says “Thomas, briefly visiting his uncle Opechancncanough and his aunt Cleopatra/Cleopatre” It doesn't say they were husband and wife though Erica.

Opechancncanough is the same person as Opachankeno [sic] mentioned in Helen Rountree's book.

Good point.

So are Mattachana and Cleopatra the same person? Mattachana was an older 1/2 sister but I'm getting contradictory info. The Matta - prefix supposedly indicated her mother was of the Mattaponi. Stachey listed some of Pawhatan's wives.

https://books.google.com/books?id=fYYMAAAAIAAJ&vq=Nectowance&am...

The Historie of Travaile Into Virginia Britinia
By William Strachey page 54

Winganuske was, I think, the sister of Machumps and the mother of Pocahantas (also known as Matoaka and Amonute) but notice how ambiguous Strachey's wording is here.

Re: So are Mattachana and Cleopatra the same person?

No one knows.

There has been a lot of discussion and research about Cleopatra on wikitree too.

The "genealogy" of Pocahontas's sister will always be in dispute as the direct, first-hand sources for her and the family are extremely non-existent. Most of the sources are repetitions of the one known historical document which merely mentions "'Dec. 17th, 1641-Thomas Wolfe petitions the Governor to let him see Opechankeno to whom he is allied, and Cleopatra, his mother's sister.

There are only two documents, neither contemporary to Cleopatra, that contain any reference to this Indian woman. Both are manuscripts, one the Randolph Manuscript and the other is the Bland Manuscript. Both are copies of old, long gone, Virginia documents. The reference which includes her comes from a book which may have contained minutes of the Virginia council meetings. The single line says Thomas Rolfe petitioned the Gov. to see Opechanko, with whom he is allied and Cleopatra, his mother's sister. This was dated 1641,

No one knows what her real Indian name was, Cleopatra is either a name given to her by the English or the copyist's attempt to read the original handwriting and getting it wrong.

There is no documented marriage, no documented name of a husband. There are no documented children. There is no documentation that would indicate who her mother was.

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Powhatan-5

Forwarding note on names discussed here....passing it on....
LINDA CARR BUCHHOLZ·FRIDAY, JULY 21, 2017
Patawomeck Tribal Historian William Deyo wrote to Linda and asked that Don Greene’s series of books of Shawnee Heritage. Do not use the Shawnee Heritage Books as your source.
Nothing concrete is known about Pocahontas’ blood line beyond her father Chief Wahunsenacawh (aka Chief Powhatan)
Following is part of an email I received from William Deyo “Deyo, Bill L CTR NSWCDD, E03A (Tribal Historian of the Patawomeck Indians of Virginia - State Recognized Tribe)
Aug 4, 2016
Hi Linda,
... Nothing is known about Powhatan's bloodline except that the great Nemattanon/Don Luis de Velasco was probably his maternal uncle. Some records call him Powhatan's father, but that was the Indian Uncle/Father relationship, as Nemattanon was not old enough to have been Powhatan's father. You have to be VERY careful if you are using the Shawnee Heritage books. They are very largely fabricated with a multitude of errors. Opechancanough was actually Cockacoeske's grandfather rather than father. That information was given by Thomas Matthews, the Indian interpreter, in his contemporary account of Bacon's Rebellion. Since Necotowance succeeded Opechancanough, it is believed that he was Opechancanough's son and the father of Cockacoeske.
.
CHIEF WAHUNSENECAWH AKA CHIEF POWHATAN - He was a Pamunkey Indian and was the leader of the Powhatan Confederacy thus giving him the name of Chief Powhatan. He was the father of Pocahontas and Cleopatra (by his wife/consort Winganuske) and the brother of Opechancanough. He was also the Great grandfather of Moytoy (aka Amatoya; Amadohityi & many other names). Chief Wahunsenecawh was my 15x grandfather. It is estimated that the paramount chief Powhatan (Wahunsenecawh) had as many as one hundred wives during his lifetime. While a man's first marriage was expected to last for life, additional marriages were likely negotiated for shorter terms. Unless a woman was married to a chief, she was allowed to conduct extramarital affairs, provided she had her husband's permission (which was usually given).
http://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/...
WINGANUSKE - Patawomeck Indian; mother of Pocahontas & Cleopatra
POCAHONTAS AKA MATOAKA, REBECCA - Pamunkey and Patawomeck Indian, daughter or Chief Wahunsenecawh, sister of Cleopatra, niece of Opechancanough, wife of Kocoum and wife of John Rolfe. Pocahontas was first married to Kocoum and had one documented child with him by the name of Kahokee “Jane”. Pocahontas was kidnapped by the English and later married John Rolfe. Pocahontas and John Rolfe had one child by the name of Thomas Rolfe.
KOCOUM - a Patawomeck Indian and younger brother of Chief Japasaw. Husband of Pocahontas and father of Kahokee “Jane”
KAHOKEE “JANE” - Pamunkey and Patawomeck Indian. Daughter of Kocoum & Pocahontas. Wife of Thomas Pettus/Pettis; mother of Christian Pettus/Pettis.
JOHN ROLFE - Englishman - Husband of Pocahontas, father of Thomas Rolfe
THOMAS ROLFE - Pamunkey, Patawomeck & English; only child of Pocahontas and John Rolfe. Husband of Jane Poythress; father of one child - Jane Matoaka Rolfe. There is another Thomas Rolfe that is often confused with him that was married to Elizabeth Washington -- that Thomas Rolfe is no relation to Pocahontas.
JANE MATOAKA ROLFE - Pamunkey, Patawomeck & English. Only child of Thomas Rolfe & Jane Poythress. Wife of Colonel Robert Bolling. Mother of one child - Colonel John Fairfax Bolling. She died of complications of childbirth when John was born
COLONEL JOHN FAIRFAX BOLLING - English, Pamunkey & Patawomeck; son of Jane Matoaka Rolfe & Robert Bolling, grandson of Thomas Rolfe & Jane Poythress, great grandson of Pocahontas & John Rolfe. Husband of Mary Kennon. Father of 7 children: John married Elizabeth Bland Blair, Jane married Colonel Richard “of Curles” Randolph, Elizabeth, Mary, Martha, Anne married James Murray & Sarah.
CLEOPATRA - Pamunkey and Patawomeck Indian. Daughter of Chief Wahunsenecawh (aka Powhatan); Sister of Pocahontas; Wife of Opechancanough (she was also his niece). (Cleopatra & Opechancanough are my 14x grandparents). Mother of Nectowance.
OPECHANCANOUGH - Pamunkey Indian. Brother of Chief Wahunsenecawh (aka Powhatan) Uncle of Pocahontas & Cleopatra. He was also the husband of Cleopatra. Father of Nectowance.
NECTOWANCE - Pamunkey and Patawomeck Indian. Son of Opechancanough & Cleopatra. Father of Cockockoske “Queen of the Pamunkey”.
COCKOCKOSKE “QUEEN OF THE PAMUNKEY” - Pamunkey & Patawomeck Indian. Daughter of Nectowance. Wife/Consort of “Totopotomoi”. Mother of Queen Anne (aka Queen Betty). Cockockoske
“
RACHEL MATTACHANA POWHATAN - Patawomeck and Pamunkey Indian. Daughter of Patawomeck Chief and a sister of Chief Wahunsenecawh (aka Chief Powhatan). Niece of Pocahontas and Cleopatra. Wife/Consort of Thomas “3rd Barron de La Warr” West ( Wife of Major Joseph Crowshaw. Mother of Unity Croshaw.
MOYTOY (AKA AMATOYA; AMADOHITYI & SEVERAL OTHER NAMES) - Pamunkey, Shawnee & English. Son of Thomas Pasmere Carpenter and Pride Cornstalk. Great grandson of Chief Wahunsenecawh (aka Chief Powhatan). Husband Quatsis “Nancy” Hop of Tellico

Charlene, exactly. This is my point.

While I appreciate all of the foregoing references for the context they give, it's really only this 1641 reference that matters.

I'm particularly skeptical of this statement:
"Thomas, briefly visiting his uncle Opechancncanough and his aunt Cleopatra"

Contrast that with the 1641 reference:
Thomas Rolfe "asked for permission to see 'Opechanko', to whom he was allied and Cleopatra, his mother's sister."

Odd that Rolfe described Opechancncanough as his ally rather than his uncle, if he was indeed his uncle.

Mattachana is better known. Full older sister, mother died giving birth to Pocohantas (I'm still skeptical they were full sisters), married to the shaman and advisor Uttamatomakin. No discussion of their family however.

This book is apparently from the Mattapony perspective

https://books.google.com/books?id=eEQjDgAAQBAJ&lpg=PT85&ots...

Helen Rountree suggests Opechancanough could have been Pawhatan's cousin rather than brother

https://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/Opechancanough_d_1646

> Helen Rountree suggests ...

I don't disagree, but -- suggests. is said, is believed, may have, could have, possibly -- these are all weasel arguments.

When I see them, alarm bells go off in my head. What follows is something that could be true. Supposedly it fits the known facts, but it's speculation.

In the case of Rountree, this kind of speculation is positive. It shows the evidence can also support another interpretation.

What I want to see, though, are solid quotations from and citations to original documents. I'm not arguing with any of the foregoing. I'm just saying that without proper sourcing it's hard to judge the quality of the different ideas.

And if "No one knows", then our Geni links should stop there.

This book is good but nothing about the wives of Uttamatomakin or OPECHANCANOUGH (who are clearly different;)

https://books.google.com/books?id=IqPqCQAAQBAJ&pg=PA63&lpg=...

The Atlantic World and Virginia, 1550-1624
edited by Peter C. Mancall

No one has found any surviving original documents. The one source we have is a transcript which may or may not have been copied correctly.

It's all we have though and only mentions one family relationship.

Cleopatra was Pocahantas's sister.

Agree, our Geni links should stop there.

Had forgotten about this & I don't know the provenance.

http://pocahontas.morenus.org/images/tree150.gif

Another reference to Matachanna

https://books.google.com/books?id=Wz8UAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA143&dq...

The History of the First Discovery and Settlement of Virginia
By William Stith Page 143

This Tomocomo (or Uttamaccomack, as Smith calls him) had Matachanna, one of Powhatan's Daughters, to Wife; was one of the chief of his Council, and of their Priests; and was esteemed a very wise and understanding Fellow among them. He was therefore sent upon this Voyage, by; Powhatan, to take the Number of the People in England, and to bring him a full and exact Account, ....

The various unsourced user trees have Cleopatra and Matachenna as different people. I can't find any names of wives of OPECHANCANOUGH. The Encyclopedia of VA article says one of them left him for another weroance.

https://books.google.com/books?id=BBwW1tA4zBsC&lpg=PA35&vq=...

Page 35 of Pocahontas, Powhatan, Opechancanough: Three Indian Lives Changed by Jamestown By Helen C. Rountree

A daughter living in 1608 (1) - I'll try and get the citation.

Sorry it's footnote 19. I think this one

https://books.google.com/books?id=BBwW1tA4zBsC&lpg=PA35&vq=...

(still on the Rountree book)

https://books.google.com/books?id=BBwW1tA4zBsC&lpg=PA35&vq=...

Opechancanough was succeeded by a male, who would have been his sister's son; sister's daughter's son; or sister's daughter's daughter's son. No one knows which.