Niketti Totopotomoi - "The Cabell's and Their Kin"

If Cockocoeske married her cousin Totopotomoi and she succeeded him as wero, she did so under her own rights, not his, plus her niece succeeded. If Necotowance had a fabricated or destroyed pedigree, the rights to become wero were not from him. So that would make his wife of the Opechancanough family. Does this make sense?

Now Necotowance is "disowned" by posterity because of the 1646 treaty. He was called by the English "king of the Indians", not of the Powhatan paramountcy (I don't think?). Cockocoeske is "Queen of the Pamunkey and diverse other tribes" - not Powhatan. The line had ended in any official way before Necotowance took over.

From https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=138379597

Tribal historian William Deyo said, "I believe that Necotowance married a woman of the same line as Pocahontas and Cleopatra, which gave his daughter, Cockacoeske, the right of succession after her husband.

"We know for a fact that Cockacoeske was the granddaughter of Opechancanough, who was the head of the federation because of the matrilineal royal succession through his mother. If Opechancanough's wife was Cleopatra, sister of Pocahontas (also of the royal line of succession), his son could succeed him as leader of the federation. Necotowance was the next in line who became the head of the federation. Totopotomoi was the next to succeed and was the husband of Cockacoeske, who succeeded in her own right after Totopotomoi (who was killed in 1656)."

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Well, Nectowance cannot have been both the father of Topo & Cockacoeske.

In Powhatan society, women could inherit power, because the inheritance of power was matrilineal. In A Map of Virginia John Smith of Jamestown explains:

His [Chief Powhatan's] kingdome descendeth not to his sonnes nor children: but first to his brethren, whereof he hath 3 namely Opitchapan, Opechancanough, and Catataugh; and after their decease to his sisters. First to the eldest sister, then to the rest: and after them to the heires male and female of the eldest sister; but never to the heires of the males.[4]

4. http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/jamestown-browse?id=J1008

Some of Powhatan's family listed here

https://books.google.com/books?id=fYYMAAAAIAAJ&vq=Nectowance&am...

The Historie of Travaile Into Virginia Britinia By William Strachey page 54

So good. such good reading. Reading. Asking Justine Petrone to check on his Dillards and copare to the Dillards in the Gates Co descendants bc I see similar names all around the Bollings that tie in Soutnern Tuscorans but none directly right into the Hughes. There's something there because of the Melungeon Town trek. It may just be their story as tri racials to pick up on that royal feel as the Melungeon NA comes through Sizemore and not in a maternal way but through the Osborne to the Sizemore women who triangulate to the women Lowry all lines from traders and the reason I know that is due to the pro we hired to figure our our NA ness and where it came from and it came specifically from Monocan marrying with Nottoway and our cousin-ness to the Southern Tuscororans came from Overton double cousin-ness to Harris and Harrison lines. We don't speak for everyone but we in MS Territory ilk do have our Melungeon faction and we know the NA from them came via Goinstown and Melungeon Trek and that by way of New Kent. If a line is following these paths, they are getting my attention. Back after I read and hear from Chowanaoke buddy Justin who is super smart.

Private User

Personally I have no reason to dis believe that there was a Cleopatra, sister to Pocahantas, with a daughter Nicketti, ancestral to the Floyd family.

But we can’t prove it, I don’t think anyone can. There is something wrong with the timelines and the geography also and we don’t know the answer to those conundrums.

And the miscegenation acts doubtless buried a lot of truths known to families ...

So work on the missing generations, see what you can dig up. There was so much lost in the Civil War I would guess there might be even more than the two generations of "no records" you noted.

Private User we are privileged to have you getting the Floyd family records into Geni, thank you so much for that effort. To be honest I hadnt appreciated the family enough until this round of looking into Nicketti, and i look forward to reading more biographies. The stories shine a light onto my own lines.

Private User then your native heritage is a lot closer in than Nicketti! You still have a lot to discover, keep at it.

You know enough about DNA to know it “washes out” quickly. So if your father “looked” Indian then you would need to find it more 1918 than 1818 ...

is there a profile for Brown?

Brown, Alexander.

The Genesis of the United States

Here are my thoughts.

Lloyd demonstrated that the babe Nicketti is seen in various native women and of varied tribal origin, I imagine we can dig up more.

What you haven’t been discussing explicitly is the “late date” of the Cleopatra / Opechanough story. This should be a glaring point to you that the story has been monkeyed with.

The chronology issues are insurmountable. What I think might have been the case is:

- Trader Hughes & his wife Nicketti of Native background unknown with a trading post in Amherst County, 1720s

- Abadiah Lewis “half Native” (different time)

- Mary Elizabeth Hughes Davis “half Native” (different time)

To me these are unrelated events smudged together.

And then - invocation of “The Pocahantas Exception” (“we’re really white & don’t take away our rights”) by cobbling together a Pocahantas sister story.

The facts are simple enough on Cleopatra: she was living on Indian lands in the Tidewater area in 1640. That’s all we know.

No one knows Opechanough ‘s wives & children.

If you separate (what looks like fabrication for political expedience) from the Nicketti stories you might get closer to the reality of (perhaps several different women).

This chronology is impossible

"She was the daughter of Robert Davis, Sr. of Amherst, who was the son of an Indian squaw. The unbroken tradition is that this squaw, the mother of the said Robert Davis, was descended from Opecancanough, not a Catawba, but a Powhatan Indian. Her husband was reported to have been an Indian trader settled in Amherst County."

So there's something missing or as I suggest, different people being conflated.

If you take it apart to a timeline with this in mind you might get closer to what actually happened.

Cleopatra lived in the Tidwater area on Pamunkey lands. Other side of the state from the Floyd's, and anyway there was no white settlement into Amherst County until the Hughes trading post in the 1720s

When was Mary Hughes Davis born?

When was Abby Davis Floyd born?

Those are the questions to establish a tree with.

Private User I do not know if Gen Floyd was involved with this or not, probably not at all, probably long before his time.

In the 1790s (?) Virginia took away rights to land, law, & voting for those of mixed native ancestry. The Bolling family, from Thomas Rolfe, got an exception put in for descendants of Pocahontas, they were "declared" white & not subject to this miscegenation act.

Thus began attempts to prove ancestry to Pocahontas.

Not from pride, not from shame, but from self preservation.

And "that" is when Nicketti, for the first time ! Became related to Cleopatra.

It was after this that the lily got gilded with an imaginary uncle / niece marriage.

None of this is in the original story of Nicketti & Trader Hughes.

And that's what I mean by "political expedience.". A fabrication for political reasons.

Jason, you're missing the point.

The easiest version of the story mentions Nicketti & Trader Hughes. That's IT. And there's a chronology problem with it, because Nicketti was known to have lived well "after" Abby Davis & Mary Hughes. Logically she's a descendant of them! (1720s). That's why I keep asking about their dates.

The Cleopatra story was invented. Fabricated. (and not by Gen Floyd). First off, we "do not know" if she was an older or younger sister of Pocohantas. We do not know if they shared a mother or only a father. We do not know her mother, her husband if any, and not her children. All we know is that she was Thomas Rolfe's aunt, living in Pamunkey territory in 1640. That's all. Anything else is fabrication.

There was a reason for grafting the story of Nicketti onto Cleopatra, that's what you're not following, and this is not trying to claim "kinship" with the Rolfe's. It's taking advantage of "the Pocahontas Exception" they got written into the law in order to retain their rights as white people. (who can blame them?).

So if you are after a true genealogy and as close to reality as we can come, you might do better to let go of the Cleopatra lineage.

It's perpetuating a useful lie that has outlived its time.

There are sources for Nicketti, in or attached to her profile.

The best (in my opinion) is this

https://archive.org/stream/tuckahoescoheess00seam#page/157/mode/2up

Lots of Floyds on the Eastern Shore - maybe not your Floyds, though. http://espl-genealogy.org/MilesFiles/site/i96.htm#s1452

It would have helped to have said where (princess) showed on the profile. I finally found it in the “occupation” field. I’ve been looking and looking at the “name” fields and never saw it because it wasn’t there.

The Jeff Davis line up to Nicketti Hughes and also the same line shared by Obama to Nicketti Hughes is solid and reported. They tidied it up when looking for the John Bunch line.

The Ancestry.com team did two years of research to puzzle this out and looked through thousands of pages of colonial records. The researchers got the DNA from the Bunch family and, even without the documented connection to John Punch, they say they're very certain of their finding about the president's slave ancestor on mother's side.

© 2012 CBS Interactive Inc. All Rights Reserved.

We’ve followed the same practices with the family of Nicketti as we do with thousands of other historic people on Geni.

Opechancanough "Mangopeesomon", paramount chief of the Powhatan is linked to Nicketti within the “father” profile so members can easily “jump over” to that tree and evaluate the evidence for themselves.

Please feel free to supply additional citations as you all have been doing.

All I can do is repeat my “personal” opinions. I do not see that Virginia historians and the Pamunkey tribal historian has validated the pedigree.

Bill Deyo is reachable.

Re: They dont say its not true either, they have no opinion on it or others opinions on her. over lost or to old history ...

That is my understanding as well. Glad we agree.

Since your Floyds are listed on the Plecker Form, that is the ethnicity link; so, that is settled ethnicity. Unrecognized Tribes number at around 250 ish in the USA. Because you are not seeking joining of a recognized tribe is one point; but,how many generations of oral history are there for the Opecanconough dad of Nicketti story? First 3 and then passed down in various lines or majority of the lines?

Time Line Summary:

2nd and 3rd Generation Dysart Story of Nicketii's grandson's sister gave thie earliest history along with his sister, and grandmas name. which followed Floyd's grandpa'Burk cousins' story which later matched 7yr after he died, upon comparison at Gen 6 and 7.
of never-before- met Cabell and Kin author cousins who two oral histories that later matched up by stranger cousin and neither group of cousins ever exchanged the story; but, has been used as VA history.

By 1843, the never-before-used Hughes name was put into use by known Free People of Color per the Plecker Report; a non traceable name for this line previous to the use of it by sir name by Trader "Hughes", passed on to Mary Hughes, the mom of Robert Davis, and this was known to his sister who married a Burk who became the Cabell and whose story matched his wife's story and that was passed to the Davis - Floyds to follow. . This oral history of Cabell, Davis, and Hughes also matched the Floyd -Davis' oral tradition and the Burke Davis History which was confirmed by the author of the Cabell and Kin book. which all of the above had the oral tradition that Nicketti "Hughes" was from a sister (later known to be Cleopatra mentioned in a petition found by the 3rd generation Floyd) with ties to Opecanconough and the petition to see Cleopatra by her Bolling nephew is what,proved their story that there was a sister who proved who Nicketti "Hughes" grandma was. This was the only story that never was exchanged between stranger cousins and then later the story by Brown came to all as the same oral tradition amongst all the cousins.

Mr. Brown came to the Floyd-Davis family to inquire about the Nicketti oral history and returned to log in the history 7 years after Gov Floyd passed.

John Floyds' mom (A FPOC per the legal status flowing from the mother to the child per the Plecker report) had the same oral history of Nicketti being born in the first part of the 1600's century. This was a first hand accounting about Nicketi from Nickett's daughter she was her 10 yr old granddaughter. of Nicketi passed down daughter.

G. J. Floyd
Today at 5:12 PM
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and John Floyds , son passed the name down. his version would been same as his dads mom.

G. J. Floyd
Today at 5:13 PM
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but it was his wife that passed it down or daughter 7yr after he died.

G. J. Floyd
Today at 5:16 PM
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im not sure the yr the petition was found, but the story couldnt be proved until that got found.

Re: UPDATE: I spoke to the tribal historian for the Powhatan Nation. He said that Jane Eagle Plume did not exist or at least not a daughter of Chief Eagle Plume and he knows nothing of Jane Dier since she is not Indian.

Has anyone talked to Bill Deyo about “Cleopatra” ?

Bill Deyo is the tribal historian for the Powhatan, and also served as a historian for the State of Virginia, I believe. He probably has an assistant just for Pocahontas questions. :)