Adam Stuart illegitimate son of James V. Did he have a daughter Mary?

A flat tombstone belonging to Adam Stewart is preserved in St. Magnus Cathedral in Kirkwall, Orkney. The inscription, with others, was the subject of a report published by the Society of Antiquaries in 1919 http://archaeologydataservice.ac.uk/archiveDS/archiveDownload?t=arc... A brief description follows:

A coat of arms, which has the appearance of being identical to the arms of the King of Scots, i.e. a lion rampant within a tressure flory and counterflory, is carved upon a monumental preserved in St. Magnus Catherdral. At the top and sides of the shield the letters L A S are inscribed (which may be an abbreviation for Lord Adam Stewart) and round the margin of the slab runs the following inscription: "adamus . steuardus . filius . illustrisimi . principis . Jacobi . quinti . scotorum . regis . qui . obit . vicesimo . die . junii . anno . domini . iii . v . lxxv" A second incomplete inscription along one edge reads: "domina . de . halcro . filia . ejusdem . fieri . fecit . hoc . sepelchrum . et ………."

From this inscription, it would appear that Lord Adam Stewart was a son of James V, King of Scots, and that he died in 1575. He had a daughter who married Halcro of that Ilk. She raised this monument to her father’s memory.

Thanks Neil, I learned that Adam Stewart was a Lord.
However you forgot an important conclusion in the PROCEEDINGS OF THE SOCIETY, MAY 12, 1919. IV. SOME FURTHER EARLY ORKNEY ARMORIALS. BY J. STORER CLOUSTON, F.S.A.Scot.

Lord Adam Stewart himself is thus shown to have been a natural son of King James V. He was therefore brother of Lord Robert Stewart, at that time feuar and afterwards Earl of Orkney. His daughter, the Lady of Halcro, was clearly Barbara Stewart, brother's daughter of Earl Robert, whose marriage contract with Henry Halcro of that ilk was dated in 1580. Sometime after her marriage she evidently caused this slab to be laid in her father's memory.

Lord Adam Stewart's widow, Janet Ruthven died intestate on 20 January 1606. Her testament dative and the inventory of her goods and gear was given up by her daughter Elspeth Stewart. No other children are mentioned. At the time of her death, Janet and her daughter Elspeth appear to have been indwellers in Perth. [National Records of Scotland, Commissary Records of Edinburgh, testament Dative of Jonet Ruthwen, relict of Adame Stewart [prior] of Charterhous, reference CC8/8/41 folios 333-34]

Since nobody has given a proof of Mary's relationship to Adam Stewart - similar like Neil did for Elspeth - I assume that:
Adam Stewart had two proven daughters: Barbara and Elspeth.
I therefore would like to disconnect Mary from Adam Stewart until there is a proof.

That seems to be a reasonable next step.

Linking to Adam Stewart.

Concerning Mary Stewart (aka Marie Stewart)

I am pleased to note that my proposition has been accepted: “The name of Mary Stewart’s father is not known.” Naturally, I have absolutely no objection to her being detached from the family of Adam Stewart. However, we should not overlook the fact that she was Robert Stewart’s niece, and, in view of this, details of this relationship should be included on the Geni tree.

Can I suggest, since the name of her father is unlikely ever to be identified, that a new son, without a forename, should be added to the family tree of James V, King of Scots, 1513-42, and that Mary Stewart should be shown as this unknown son's daughter.

The abridged charter, which follows, provides proof of the relationship between Mary Stewart and Robert Stewart:

17 May 1580: Instrument of Resignation and Sasine under the hand of William Fermoir, notary public narrating that Magnus Sinclair in Skaill, within the close of the Yairdis in the town of Kirkwall, for fulfilling of the '''Contract of Marriage between Johne Sinclair, his eldest son and Marie Stewart brother's daughter to Lord Robert Stewart, feaur of Orknay and Zetland, resigned to said lord, as superior, all his heritable lands as well conquest as pertaining to him of old heritage, either in Orknay or Zetland whereupon said Lord 'dimittit' same in the hands of said Johne and Marie to be 'bruikit' by them and the survivor of them in conjunct fee, and after their decease to the heirs gotten between them, whom failing, said Johne's heirs and assignees whomsoever in heritage, for yearly payment to the king and kirk of scatt and teind as use is. And therefore, by virtue of said Lord's precept directed to Johnne Langskaill and William Aitkin, bailies in that part, said John Langskaill passed to the lands of Tohop lying in Sanct Androis parish, and said William passed to the lands of Brabester within the parish of Deirnes both within the 'Manelnad of Orkney'; and there gave Sasine of said lands to said Johne Sinclair accordingly. Witnesses, Magnus Tailyeour, Magnus Smiyth, Nyniane Smyth, Henre Smyth, Magnus Prence, Magnus Paplay.
[http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?... National Records of Scotland, Register House charters, 1st series, reference RH6/2550]

Will a new discussion be started for Adam Stewart, or will we continue to give consideration to him here?

Continue here.

Thanks Justin for disconnecting Mary and we should certainly continue the discussion here.

There is no doubt about that Robert Stewart had several Mary's as relatives.

First of all a halvsister and Queen, then a cousin and also a niece. However I miss the relation to Adam Stewart.

1. Barbara married with Halcro of that Ilk has a relationship which is put in the tombstone.
2. Janet Ruthvens testament names Espeth as her daughter.

Obviously there are a lot of documents in the National Records of Scotland. Please continue the research to find a relation between Adam, Mary and John Sinclair.

Do we really know all about Robert Stewarts relatives? All his brothers and halvbrothers? All his cousins?
https://archive.org/stream/scotspeeragefoun06pauluoft#page/572/mode...

Trying to study the tree of Adam and Robort Stewart and James V I can see many NNs and many Marys and also Adams.
I certainly doubt that the James V tree is correct. This tree looks like a rabbit hole.

Please clean up James V tree. If this is done we could discuss Adam and Mary Stewart. The Scots peerage is unfortunately guesswork - same as the Swedish peerage.

Adam Stewart is the bastard son of James V, King of Scots. He is generally stated to have been the son of Helenor Stewart (sometimes referred to as Elizabeth Stewart), who was the daughter of John, third earl of Lennox, although Peter D. Anderson, in his 1982 account of Robert Stewart, Earl of Orkney, Lord of Shetland, was unable to identify any evidence which might tend to confirm this. The date of Adam Stewart’s birth is unknown.

4 July 1568: Tack by Dean Adam Forman, prior of Charterhouse called the Vale of Virtue beside burgh of Perth, with consent of convent thereof, to Colin Campbell of Glenurquhay and Katherine Ruthven, his spouse, and Duncan Campbell, their son and apparent heir, of lands of Artollonyth with miln thereof, fishings on Lochtay, and lands of Ballacrag, in lordship of Glendochard, sheriffdom of Perth, for 6 years. Witnesses: Patrick, lord Ruthven, Mr Alexander Levingstoun of Doanypace, William Moncreif of that ilk, Sir Robert Forman of Luthry, kt., Lyon king of arms, George Johneson, burgess of Perth, Robert Rollok and Henry Eldar, chaplains and notaries. Applied papered common seal of Charterhouse, damaged. Signed by granter and members of convent: sir John Burnat, sir Walter Touris, ?treasurer, sir John Syme, procurator, sir Andrew Blythman, sir James Meak, vicar, sir William Clapene, sir Alexander Calland and sir Adam Stewart. Slightly damaged. [Papers of the Campbell Family, Earls of Breadalbane (Breadalbane Muniments). Reference GD112/1/100] http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?...

26 September 1560: Accounts of Custumars and Bailies of Burghs, rendered at Edinburgh, A. D. 1560. Computum Thome Scot, custumarii de Perth redditum per eundum, [Edinburgh, 26 September 1560, from 21 August 1559. Charge £126, great custom of said burgh by tack to accountant, date 6 September 1558. Discharge. To comptroller, £10. To prior and convent of Charterhouse, by receipt of Adame Stewarte, alleged to be factor thereof, £26.13s.4d. To prior and convent of St. Andrews, 40s. [George Powell McNeill, M.A., LL.B. (editor), Rotuli Scaccarii Regum Scotorm. The Exchequer Rolls of Scotland, xix, A. D. 1557-1567, page 109] https://archive.org/stream/exchequerrollss03exchgoog#page/n189/mode...

1

2 December 1573: Feu charter by James, bishop of Dunkeld, to Colin Campbell of Glenurquhay and Katherine Ruthven, his spouse, of lodging belonging to cathedral church of Dunkeld in burgh of Perth, on north part of South St., between lands of John Campbell of Laweris, William Wilsone and William Andersone on east, lands of James Robertsone to the west, graveyard of said burgh on north and the common way called the Southgait on south, 2 December 1573. Signed by James, bishop of Dunkeld, Mr William Edmonstoun, chancellor of Dunkeld, Mr Thomas McGibboun, prebend of Monyde, Jo. Bartoun, dean of Dunkeld, David Spens, archdean, Mr James Lauder, prebend of Fardischaw, [Logiebride], Mr David McGill, prebendar of Fongart, Duncan McNair, treasurer, Thomas Crukschank of Lundeiff, and William Drummond of Creif. Seals of granter and of chapter of cathedral kirk of Dunkeld, both almost entire on tags.

2

10 December 1573: Instrument of sasine following on the above mentioned feu charter Notary: Henry Elder, St Andrews diocese. Witnesses: Patrick Eviot of Balhoussy, Andrew Marsar, bailie, Adam Stewart, pensioner of Chartarhouss, David Murray, Gavin Hammiltoun, Dougal Campbell, servants of said Colin, Alexander Quhite, George Bow, burgesses, and William Ross, sergeant of said burgh.

1

2 December 1573: Feu charter by James, bishop of Dunkeld, to Colin Campbell of Glenurquhay and Katherine Ruthven, his spouse, of lodging belonging to cathedral church of Dunkeld in burgh of Perth, on north part of South St., between lands of John Campbell of Laweris, William Wilsone and William Andersone on east, lands of James Robertsone to the west, graveyard of said burgh on north and the common way called the Southgait on south, 2 December 1573. Signed by James, bishop of Dunkeld, Mr William Edmonstoun, chancellor of Dunkeld, Mr Thomas McGibboun, prebend of Monyde, Jo. Bartoun, dean of Dunkeld, David Spens, archdean, Mr James Lauder, prebend of Fardischaw, [Logiebride], Mr David McGill, prebendar of Fongart, Duncan McNair, treasurer, Thomas Crukschank of Lundeiff, and William Drummond of Creif. Seals of granter and of chapter of cathedral kirk of Dunkeld, both almost entire on tags.

2

10 December 1573: Instrument of sasine following on the above mentioned feu charter Notary: Henry Elder, St Andrews diocese. Witnesses: Patrick Eviot of Balhoussy, Andrew Marsar, bailie, Adam Stewart, pensioner of Chartarhouss, David Murray, Gavin Hammiltoun, Dougal Campbell, servants of said Colin, Alexander Quhite, George Bow, burgesses, and William Ross, sergeant of said burgh. [Papers of the Campbell Family, Earls of Breadalbane (Breadalbane Muniments), reference GD112/2/130] http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?...

Concerning Adam Stewart’s connection with Orkney

Peter D. Anderson included a brief biographical account of Adam Stewart in his book about Earl Robert Stewart. Concerning Adam’s connection with Orkney, Anderson places him at Edinburgh on 1 November 1572, in the witness list of a contract concerned with the sale of Orkney produce, and he makes mention of his death in Orkney on 20 June 1575 and his burial in the Cathedral dedicated to St. Magnus in Kirkwall. [Robert Stewart Earl of Orkney Lord of Shetland 1533-1593 (John Donald, Edinburgh, 1982), pp. 156-68].

Anderson was unable to identify any other connection with Orkney but the following charter suggests that he may have been one of the canons of the Cathedral Church of Orkney:

3 February 1540-41: Instrument containing process of ratification by John Williamson, provost of collegiate church of Seiton, and Adam Stewart, canon of the cathedral church of Orkney, judges delegate appointed by Anthony, cardinal priest of SS Quatuor Coronati, of feu charter, 18 Jan 1539/1540, by Andrew, abbot of Melrose, and the convent thereof, in favour of William Linlithqw, son of deceased David Linlithqw, in liferent, and John Linlithqw, his son and apparent heir, in fee. [Leith-Buchanan of Ross and Drummakil, reference GD47/25] http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?...

Concerning Adam Stewart’s connection with Orkney

Peter D. Anderson included a brief biographical account of Adam Stewart in his book about Earl Robert Stewart. Concerning Adam’s connection with Orkney, Anderson places him at Edinburgh on 1 November 1572, in the witness list of a contract concerned with the sale of Orkney produce, and he makes mention of his death in Orkney on 20 June 1575 and his burial in the Cathedral dedicated to St. Magnus in Kirkwall. [Robert Stewart Earl of Orkney Lord of Shetland 1533-1593 (John Donald, Edinburgh, 1982), pp. 156-68].

Anderson was unable to identify any other connection with Orkney but the following charter suggests that he may have been one of the canons of the Cathedral Church of Orkney:

3 February 1540-41: Instrument containing process of ratification by John Williamson, provost of collegiate church of Seiton, and Adam Stewart, canon of the cathedral church of Orkney, judges delegate appointed by Anthony, cardinal priest of SS Quatuor Coronati, of feu charter, 18 Jan 1539/1540, by Andrew, abbot of Melrose, and the convent thereof, in favour of William Linlithqw, son of deceased David Linlithqw, in liferent, and John Linlithqw, his son and apparent heir, in fee. [Leith-Buchanan of Ross and Drummakil, reference GD47/25] http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?...

Prior of Coldingham

Adam Stewart was never prior of Charterhouse. He does seem to have been member of the convent of Charterhouse, though, or to have been provided with a monk's living, possibly through the influence of his royal father, and he was provided with a pension from the income of Charterhouse, possibly as part of an arrangement for the support of the monks post Reformation.

He acted a factor of Charterhouse on 26 September 1560. He witnessed a tack on 4 July 1568, evidently as a member of the convent of charterhouse, and he is noticed as a pensioner of Charterhouse on 10 December 1573. During all of these years Adam Forman was prior.

Adam Stewart is first noticed as prior of Charterhouse two years after his death, on 3 April 1577 [Register of the Privy seal of Scotland, vii, number 1003], and he is referred to as prior in the testament dative of his widow. In his book about Earl Robert Stewart, Anderson suggests that the contracted form of the word 'pensioner' has very likely been read as 'prior' by a later copyist and the error perpetuated in the [Robert Stewart Earl of Orkney Lord of Shetland 1533-1593 (John Donald, Edinburgh, 1982), pp. 157].

Neil, appreciate your effort to resolve all Adam and Mary Stewart 's history. However, I do not appreciate your latest approach to simply add NN - dummies. I made them fake - dummies.

Why do you need this fake NN's? I think that they will be removed soon.

They aren't exactly fake NN's -- they represent places where, literally, we do not know what the name of someone was.

I have held off on locking relationships on Mary, while watching all of this going on, but one way to keep from having to put in the N.N. profiles is simply to lock things down, so that in this case Mary doesn't get reconnected to any purported parent.

Much cleaner, though it means that non-curators can't add relationships.

The N.N. by the way (for anybody who wonders) stands for "nomen nescio" -- "I do not know the name."

Anne Brannen, I would appreciate if a curator would not follow some user's glory or fame or Scot's inheritage. Simple facts and what does Neil or you know about Swedish history? Probably very little.
Sitting in the librarary of Stockholm ( KB Kungliga bibliotek) I cannot find a relationship between James (some funny scots clanleader) and any Mary Stewart. There are hundreds of Mary's and thousands of Stewarts but there is simply no connection between Neil and the funny Scots through Mary Stewart.
What has geni become? Fantasy?

I don't object to the N.N's per se, but this set includes James V so it is not just a generic statement her parents are unknown. This set of unknowns is making an explicit claim.

We are better to hold off making this explicit claim until we are sure. I have been intending to lock the relationships but wanted to wait while this discussion unfolds.

Would it be better to disconnect and lock?

Mary Stewart was the niece of Robert Stewart, Earl of Orkney and Lord of Shetland (She is called brother's daughter by Earl Robert). At least two well-respected historians have accepted this as an established fact and Geni subscribers should have no difficulty in accepting this too. It follows, therefore, that her father was a son of James V, King of Scots (unless Ear Robert was not the King's son). The name of her father has not been identified (and it seems unlikely that it ever will be) but Mary Stewart should never the less be included in her royal grandfather’s family tree. To deny her a place in his tree would be unreasonable, not to say extremely petty.

In the circumstances I have described, it would be wrong to identify Mary Stewart as the daughter of any of the known sons of James V, King of Scots. This would be pick-and-mix genealogy of the worst kind (we already have too much of this to contend with on Geni) but she should be included in her grandfather’s family tree, as the daughter of an unknown father and mother. I have created N. N. profiles for this purpose, and I would argue that this is not fake or bogus genealogy. On the contrary, it is honest well-researched genealogy.

I'm with Justin Durand -- I would like to disconnect and lock, with clear curator's notes and the information in the Overview.

I hadn't caught it, that the N.N.'s were connected to the tree.

There is nothing "petty" about not connecting people to families when we don't know the exact connection.

This is a constant problem on Geni, and not just in the middle ages and early modern era. Many Welsh people knew themselves to be descended from Elystan Glodrydd, but if we don't know the lineage we don't put it in. We have notes in the profiles that say "descended from Elystan Glodrydd." This isn't petty.

It would be fine with me to add, into the father N.N. profile, the note "probably the son of" -- and then add links, and more stuff into the over view.

This is the evidence you are citing.
http://catalogue.nrscotland.gov.uk/nrsonlinecatalogue/details.aspx?...

I would like to understand better what Gerhard's argument is before we make changes to a tree for everyone.

My caution is this -- when she is called "brother's daughter" of Robert that is technically ambiguous because it could describe a daughter of Robert's half-brother on either side. The surname Stewart certainly suggests a brother or half-brother on the father's side, but we don't know enough about the life of Euphemia Elphinstone to know whether she had another Stewart husband or lover.

So my question is this -- what other evidence exists about Robert's unnamed brothers?

I get the impression that Gerhard is a serious student of history, and I admire that. I am not sure what he means, though, when he says; "Sitting in the librarary of Stockholm (KB Kungliga bibliotek) I cannot find a relationship between James (some funny scots clan leader) and any Mary Stewart. There are hundreds of Mary's and thousands of Stewarts but there is simply no connection between Neil and the funny Scots through Mary Stewart." Something may be lost in translation here. I refuse to believe that Gerhard is as unkind as this statement suggests.

For the benefit of Gerhard: The James he speaks of was not some funny Scots clan leader. He was the King of Scots. Moreover, he was the father of Mary, Queen of Scots (Swedish history books may have overlooked her). For the avoidance of doubt, I should also say. I am not related in blood to the Mary Stewart under discussion here, or to her royal aunt. My interest in her is purely academic. She was originally identified as a daughter of Earl Robert’s brother Adam Stewart (who is still incorrectly identified as the prior of Charterhouse) and I was keen to correct this (as was Gerhard). Having made these points, I should also hold my hand up to being one of the funny Scots so beloved by Gerhard, although I do not feel particularly amusing right now!

Private User Justin's question is very specific and goes to the heart of the matter. The important language in the document is ambiguous by its very nature.

So we need corroboration.

I do not understand the Scots complains. There is no clan of any James (who called
himself a "king") connected to Sweden and you have to prove it. This has not happened yet, Please prove the connection to Sweden.
I know very well the history of Scots in Sweden: https://www.geni.com/projects/The-Royal-Bachelors-Club-History-of-G...

Stewarts, Adam and Mary there were thousands of them - why not add some more?
Adam Stewart

I will send you another Adam Stewart if you want to.

With all tthe Maries and the Adams from Scotland. I might start a project with Marie/Adam/Scotland who are descendant of the James clan.

Best regards

Why

Neil, and by the way..I know a little about the Scots. There was a simple clan society when James - the so called king - tried to rule. The Clan - today it is called mafia - ruled Scotland. Do you agree upon that?