Cecily de Norwich (de Valoines), Countess Suffolk Baroness Ufford - Conflicting evidence

Started by Will Chapman (Vol. Curator) on Monday, May 16, 2016
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5/16/2016 at 12:11 AM

I've spent sometime looking at the 'sources' and I'm not convinced that Cecily de Valoines married Geoffrey of Norwich as suggested by http://www.lisa.com/bdm/d/de_valoines/cecily_de_valoines_105258.html.

Above all, the source at http://www.knight-france.com/geneal/names/2421.htm appears to have more historical support which I will continue to try and tie down.

Can anyone contribute any other sources that might contribute?

Will Chapman Jr

5/16/2016 at 1:53 AM

http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ENGLISH%20NOBILITY%20MEDIEVAL2.htm

ROBERT de Ufford, son of --- (-before 9 Sep 1298).  He had interests in Ufford, Suffolk[485]. 

m firstly (before 12 May 1273) as her second husband, MARY, widow of WILLIAM de Say, daughter of --- (-after 10 Aug 1280). 
m secondly (before [1286/87]) JOAN, daughter of --- (-after 18 Nov 1307). 

Robert de Ufford & his first wife had two children

1.         ROBERT de Ufford (11 Jun 1279-9 Sep 1316 or before).  He was summoned to Parliament 4 Mar 1309, whereby he is held to have become Lord Ufford.  m (before 1298) CECILY de Valoignes, daughter of ROBERT de Valoignes & his wife Eva Tregoz née --- ([1280/81]-16 Jul 1325).  Robert & his wife had six children:  ....

http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/ENGLISHNOBILITYMEDIEVAL3T-Z.htm#Cec...

1.         ROBERT de Valoignes (-after 6 Aug 1282).  m ---.  The name of Robert’s wife is not known.  Robert & his wife had one child: 

a)         ROBERT de Valoignes (-before 6 Aug 1282).  A writ dated 6 Aug "10 Edw I", after the death of "Robert son of Robert de Valoignes alias de Waleyns, de Valonyes, de Waloynis, de Waloniis, de Valoynes", named "his daughters Roysea aged 2 at the feast of All Saints 10 Edw I and Cecily aged 1 about the same feast are his next heirs” and specifies the dower of “Eva late his wife...the king’s cousin”[511].  m EVA, daughter of ---.  A writ dated 6 Aug "10 Edw I", after the death of "Robert son of Robert de Valoignes alias de Waleyns, de Valonyes, de Waloynis, de Waloniis, de Valoynes", named "his daughters Roysea aged 2 at the feast of All Saints 10 Edw I and Cecily aged 1 about the same feast are his next heirs” and specifies the dower of “Eva late his wife...the king’s cousin”[512].  Robert & his wife had two children: 

ii)         CECILY de Valoignes ([1280/81]-16 Jul 1325).  A writ dated 6 Aug "10 Edw I", after the death of "Robert son of Robert de Valoignes alias de Waleyns, de Valonyes, de Waloynis, de Waloniis, de Valoynes", named "his daughters Roysea aged 2 at the feast of All Saints 10 Edw I and Cecily aged 1 about the same feast are his next heirs” and specifies the dower of “Eva late his wife...the king’s cousin”[514].  m (before 1298) ROBERT de Ufford, son of ROBERT de Ufford & his first wife Mary --- (11 Jun 1279-9 Sep 1316 or before).  He was summoned to Parliament 4 Mar 1309, whereby he is held to have become Lord Ufford. 

5/16/2016 at 1:58 AM

Looks like the first Robert d'Ufford

Sir Robert de Ufford, Justicar

5/16/2016 at 8:39 AM

The de Norwich family tree is here


Alfred Suckling, 'Mettingham', in The History and Antiquities of the County of Suffolk: Volume 1 (Ipswich, 1846), pp. 168-183. British History Online http://www.british-history.ac.uk/no-series/suffolk-history-antiquit... [accessed 8 May 2016].

http://www.british-history.ac.uk/sites/default/files/publications/p...

The name of the wife of Geoffrey de Norwich (father of Walter) seems unknown, according to Burke's, as quoted here

http://cybergata.com/roots/4260.htm

5/16/2016 at 8:43 AM

If we look at revisions on the profile for "Cecily" she did indeed start as NN


NN was added as walter de norwich's spouse by Oct 1, 2013 at 4:37 PM

I would revert to that and annotate the "Lisa" site cite, and add the more valid ones.

1/29/2017 at 1:39 AM

DOB of Cecily is ten years after her son Walter

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