God Almighty is not "Deceased" as claimed by geni.com

Shmuel-Aharon Kam (Kahn / שמואל-אהרן קם (קאן is the curator of God Almighty .

Shmuel-Aharon Kam (Kahn / שמואל-אהרן קם (קאן . then claims that “God Almighty” is also known by the name “Allah”.
The God of Israel is definitely not the same as the God of Islam. God and Allah are not the same person. In this respect I quote the Reverent Billy Graham “Our challenge is to speak truthfully about God, and the only way we can do that is to use the names God gave Himself. The God of the Bible is not Allah, and Allah is not the God of the Bible. Any confusion about that undermines the very Gospel we preach”.

Did you look AT the profile?
This is explained in the "About Me" section, as this request comes up constantly. See also many discussions under Discussions.

I don't really care what a foolish bigot like Billy Graham says.
Again whether this is the "same" G-d or not, is irrelevant. This is a GENEALOGY website, NOT a theological debate. As such the three Bible derived religions (Christianity, Islam and Judaism) share a common family TREE (with very few exceptions). So they will also share a single God profile.

My personal opinion is that this profile should be deleted. G-d isn't a "father" in ANY normal sense of the word, nor are humans his children in a genealogical sense. BUT I respect the will of many dozens of other users, who added this profile, to the SHARED tree.

If you have theological issues with this profile, I'm sure you'll be thrilled with the dozens of profiles of pretty much all pagan pantheons.

I stongly object agains God to be on Geni. Adam was the first human being on earth.

There are a number of viewpoints on this - I'm in favour of Nietzsche's:

The Parable of the Madman: Have you not heard of that madman who lit a lantern in the bright morning hours, ran to the market-place, and cried incessantly: "I am looking for God! I am looking for God!"
As many of those who did not believe in God were standing together there, he excited considerable laughter. Have you lost him, then? said one. Did he lose his way like a child? said another. Or is he hiding? Is he afraid of us? Has he gone on a voyage? or emigrated? Thus they shouted and laughed. The madman sprang into their midst and pierced them with his glances.

"Where has God gone?" he cried. "I shall tell you. We have killed him - you and I. We are his murderers. But how have we done this? How were we able to drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What did we do when we unchained the earth from its sun? Whither is it moving now? Whither are we moving now? Away from all suns? Are we not perpetually falling? Backward, sideward, forward, in all directions? Is there any up or down left? Are we not straying as through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not become colder? Is it not more and more night coming on all the time? Must not lanterns be lit in the morning? Do we not hear anything yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we not smell anything yet of God's decomposition? Gods too decompose. God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we, murderers of all murderers, console ourselves? That which was the holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet possessed has bled to death under our knives. Who will wipe this blood off us? With what water could we purify ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we need to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we not ourselves become gods simply to be worthy of it? There has never been a greater deed; and whosoever shall be born after us - for the sake of this deed he shall be part of a higher history than all history hitherto."

Here the madman fell silent and again regarded his listeners; and they too were silent and stared at him in astonishment. At last he threw his lantern to the ground, and it broke and went out. "I have come too early," he said then; "my time has not come yet. The tremendous event is still on its way, still travelling - it has not yet reached the ears of men. Lightning and thunder require time, the light of the stars requires time, deeds require time even after they are done, before they can be seen and heard. This deed is still more distant from them than the distant stars - and yet they have done it themselves."

It has been further related that on that same day the madman entered divers churches and there sang a requiem. Led out and quietened, he is said to have retorted each time: "what are these churches now if they are not the tombs and sepulchres of God?"
Friedrich Nietzsche: The Gay Science

If you want to share genealogy on a website like Geni, the first thing you have to accept is that other people might have different opinions. I don't see any payoff to arguing about the profile for God. Everyone can look at the profile and make up their own minds.

:-)

If one believes that there is no God then he cannot be "Deceased", Non-existent entities cannot die.

If you place God in a position of being the parent(s) of the first known man you can also not claim that He is "Deceased". God (who ever anyone regard as their god) has to be omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient and everlasting. I cannot believe that any religion in the world would pray to a god that is dead - and as far as I know all religions do pray in some form.

A entity that can die cannot be God. No matter how many opinions there are. When talking about God you cannot describe him as dead or "deceased". I agree - rather remove the profile of the "Deceased" god from Geni.

this discution i hope with the time will bring more positive and evolutive,

G_o_d =alive but but into our phisical world as human
also theological is realy close to genealogy as for archeology it the first recorded writing of (oral) tradition without this human history =....
i agree to delete this profile
do we have to create Lilith first wife of adam?
wife of cain genealogy?
angel archangel satan ?
adam was the first man i doubt this. adam -3760
indigeous ppl of america=14000 history (google it)

and finaly i agree with mr Swanström

(Everyone can look at the profile and make up their own minds.)

i hope i will not get negative after my comments

Amazing how, when being requested to read the overview, - no one reads the overview. :)

It says:

Curator comments:

This profile being marked as "deceased" is NOT a theological statement. It is that way for purely technical reasons. Geni's system automatically applies more restrictive privacy rules to living profiles.

Many users want this profile removed. They think it inappropriate either because they are non-believers or because it's not right to have God as an actual "father" of Adam & Eve. This profile remains, because many of the people who add the biblical lineage ALSO have this profile. So regardless of how many times it would get removed, it would get added back in the next merge.

=====

Support your friendly neighborhood curators. We've been doing this for eternity (pun intended).

Well, The IDEA of God is certainly Alive and well on the Planet. The category of being alive has a unique and specific application to the functioning of the Geni apparatus. So let us not sweat the small stuff.

The notion that the alleged Created beings of the Creator-GOD can in turn comprehend and understand that kind of being is, well....a reach born of way too much Hubris and requires an intellect superior to the one which gave rise to we Human beings. That's a really, really silly exercise in Navel-worship in my view. Time to move on.

FYI...Coenraad.....
a while back while researching my wife's families genealogy on GENI I accidentally tapped into the biblical GENI family which claimed we were directly related to that line. I added them into our tree and during a two day period went all the way back to G-d Almighty. The next morning I noticed on my home page that ...I...had listed G-d as deceased...in fact it was accidental.
Now even though we are secular and probably (?) agnostic) I felt really bad about that...sooooo...I changed deceased to alive on my tree.

MY POINT IS...if it bothers you just change YOUR GENI tree to reflect your preferred description of His life status!!!...why "hock" the rest of us???

Sorry Norm, I can't do that because the profile of "God Almighty" is locked for editing accompanied by a proposal that I start a discussion about it
.
The non-believers who run this show (by that I do not mean the Curator's because they did not create the software) are adamant not to change it. I don't want to start a theological discussion but the God that I believe in is very much alive. I do not accept "technical reasons” as an excuse. People control how computer software should work and not the other way around.

The privacy policy - written by people - states that living person are kept private. I am comfortable with the curatorial decision as this site is for genealogy, not theology. Everyone shares the tree. Your beliefs are your private business, as are mine. Neither has a place for discussions of genealogy (except in passing).

Isn't it possible now to have living profiles be public MPs?

First , many thanks Justin for the tips, second, regarding privacy policy,
I stumbled on a forefather who lived a couple of hundred years ago, certainly dead, but was set to private, isn't that against the rules?

You can contact Geni about it. It's not against the rules, but Geni has said several times they would want to see a good reason for a profile before about 1850 to be private.

If the Faraons declared them self as grandchilds of Ra, so does
that not change the fact that they were existing people, so the
tree are just a tree no matter what they had claimed to be,
and reagarding oden have many, like snorre, belived that also
he was just a King that after his death become mystified, so
his tree would just reflect that too, in fact, the most Gods seems
to have had a similar background, Buddha was born 600 BC,
a real person with a family line of decent, should we not have him
in the tree just because he today have worshippers?

Obviously, when it comes to real fantasy product like e.g. Hobbits,
they should not be any part of any genealogy tree, for that reason
that they are and never had been real living existing persons,
so it is not okay to compare "spaghettimonsters", derived from
Russell's teapot etc. If we use the thesis, that for example Adam
and Eve have existed, and that they are the forefathers of a lineage
of decendant, then we would stumble upon real person soner or
later, the first part, or any missing parts beteween them, would
just be seen as part of a tree, not a hole one with every name, but
a symbolic one, were the gaps are irrelevant for the claim that they
were theirs forefathers, in this view, it is not relevant if God was a
man, or supernatural being, it still represents the beginning of that line.

Jesus! ; )
http://www.geni.com/path/Ulf-Martinsson+is+related+to+Jesus-of-Naza...

In this line you find Odin right in it.
http://www.geni.com/path/Ulf-Martinsson+is+related+to+Saint-Matthew...

Ingegerd Knudsdatter af Danmark is Ulf Ingvar Göte Martinsson's 21st great grandmother!
http://www.geni.com/path/Ulf-Martinsson+is+related+to+Ingegerd-af-D...

I am following your resoning,
1086 the year Ingegerd was born
1965 is the year I was born
879 are the years between us
so I'm dividing the generations with
23
comes up with
38
38 is the average age. Is it possible so far, then we could also double that,

1758 is then the new sum of the total amount of years,
that corresponds well with your example "1700".

Well Coenraad you seem to be right. I went back to my GENI tree and "G-d Almighty" is listed as my wife's 86th Great Grandfather...and I'm listed as one of the managers and able to edit the file...but I can't change the deceased designation to living anymore???

If we are listed as family why is it private?

ALSO someone named Theresa Louise Schneider (Vangheluwe) has added an un-named wife...so what keeps me from taking the whole thing backwards to Darth Vader or someone??? Now I wouldn't do that because people take their religion very seriously but it is possible I suppose.

I guess that in the beginning of 1900, earth had approximately
1.5 billion people, 2000 years ago fewer than 500 miljon people,
somewhere around 2300 BC, should all europeans living today around the world have a common ancestor that lived in the middle east.

We have a common male forefather around 60-90.000 tousand years ago for all mankind, and a female dito 150-250.000 years ago.

Then we have the "out of Africa hypothesis" that "we" left Africa for some
60.000 years ago, then we have arceological findings suggesting that humankind have been widely the same as today for at least 1.8 miljon year.

Where in this line would you put in Darth Vader Norm?

Gerhard, I try not to say too much about these old lines but since you ask ...

I've been working on getting them fixed in some reasonable way ever since I've been on Geni, but it's very hard. We have to keep the fake profiles, or people will assume we don't know about them, and add them back. It would be good if none of us were connected to any of the fakes, but the best we can hope for right now is not to be actually descended from them.

It's very hard to cut the bad lines. You have to merge all the duplicates, and keep merging the new duplicates. And you have know where the fakery starts, and document it with good sources. You can't just start slashing.

We had someone who cut 80 something connections in one marathon session, but they did it arbitrarily, in nonsensical places, and they didn't document the reason. That means that dozens of other users think we just didn't have all the information, so they started adding new duplicates.

Any time you cut a connection the users who agree don't say anything, but a small number of users scream because they are no longer descended from Jesus (or whomever it is they want to be descended from). Just this week we saw a user trying to defend a fake connection to the dukes of Normandy. It takes a lot of time and energy to argue.

I don't know about any Irish orcs. In fact, I'm not aware of any orcs on Geni at all. Can you give me a link? I'll take a look.

If you're descended from Adam and Eve (or King David), and if you're not Jewish, and if the line doesn't go through Paloma ha-Leví Benveniste, it's a fake. And if the line does go through Paloma, there is a lot of argument about whether it's fake ;)

if you are Ashkenazi Jewish, as I am, and you show a connection on Geni to another Ashkenazi Jew at 57th cousin, as I do - is that a fake? Not really? Just that the common ancestors of all Ashkenazi Jews (science now indicating there were some 350 of them only possibly ? In the (I forget? 12th century possibly) ? Have yet to be identified ...

On the tree of “God Almighty” Adam and Eve are shown to be born circa -3760 which is 190 years after the birth of their son Cain in circa -3950 and 163 years after the death of Abel in circa -3923. Many of the purported other children, and even grandchildren, of Adam and Eve are also claimed to have been born before Adam and Eve. It seems as if we are living in a fool’s paradise if we believe anything we find on this website. Perhaps we should just see it as an “entertainment website” - and don’t we all love entertainment? The word "circa" is used so freely that it ridicules the quality/reliability of information.

Why don't you submit date corrections to the managers / curators to implement ? Use the "contact manager" link on the profile with the correct information and a citation for it.

Geni is only as good as each of us can make it. If you don't care to help fix errors, don't complain about it.

Norm - You said above “ "G-d Almighty" is listed as my wife's 86 th Great Grandfather” which obviously means that Adam was her 85 th grandfather.
By stealing some logic from Gerhard above 86 th great granddaughter which responds to 88 generations. You are very secretive on your profile and the birth dates of neither you or your wife are shown on GENI. You have grand children so let’s assume you were both born circa 1950. (3760+1950=5710 divided by 88 is 65. This implies that through 88 generations the parents had been 65 years old when getting a child in the future Hager family.
According to Geni Adam is my 120 th great grandfather which responds to 122 generations. My birth date is public (1948) - 3760+1948=5708 divided by 122 = 47. Thus through 122 generations my ancestors gave birth at the average ripe “young” age of 47 for me to be born. My own father did a bit better since he caused me to be born when he was 31 yo which coincides with the average age from King David to me through 93 generations of 32. But then this is also very unreliable because Yonati "Paloma" bat Gedaliah does not appear in the family line from King David to me - which according to Justin Swanström is a necessity. Jacques I, King of Cyprus (born 1334) is shown in my line where “Paloma” (born 1335) - according to Justin - belongs.
Geni thus are founded on masses of very unreliable data which obviously stem from the many participants/unreliable resources.

Erica - I believe you are proud of Geni but I will have to write to thousands of Curators to request corrections to profiles where neither them nor you nor me know what the correct profile information would be. The calculations as described in my last contribution taken over many centuries just do not make sense. I appreciate the contributions of people like you but if only qualified curators were allowed to feed in information or create/approve links the situation might have been better. The situation has in my view been allowed to deteriorate to far. I wish it could be rectified because I am on the site to determine and be proud of my heritage. Can I be proud of anything with the misinformation on all genealogy sites - they all borrow from each other. Can You help?

Erica - I see you are stated as my 22nd cousin with some notable nobility in between. I trust that the linage is reliable and am therefore glad to meet you