Jacquette de Savoye, b9 - Aletta & Jacquette: aliases?

Did you see the notes in Jacquette's About?

M Boucher's "French Speakers at the Cape" page 267-8

"From Sas van Gent Jacques de Savoye went to Middelburg, where his wife gave birth to a son Jacques and, it would seem, to a daughter Jacquette, baptised on April 2 1687. It was from the Zeeland capital, after a public sale of household goods, that Jacques and his family left for the Cape of Good Hope. [Reference given FWK:(De) Savoye; FRANKEN, 'Franse vlugtelinge', IV, Die huisgenoot, X, 214, April 30, p.15.]

From Delia Robertson -

"The source for Jacquette comes from Boucher, M: French Speakers at the Cape in his section on Jacques de Savoye snr at pp.264-269. Jacquette was baptised with her brother Jacques (a twin?) on April 12, 1687 in Middelburg, Zeelant. Boucher is considered very reliable, but I have been checking every now and then to see if the records for Middelburg ever pop up on any of the Netherlands sites or on familysearch.

However nothing yet. If you can add to the sourcing for any of these, or other families, I would be grateful.

.I do have her as died young ... ca Jan 1688 ... in my data, but that tag did not make it on to the website. It will be included in the next update."

If they arrived in South Africa 1688 with 2 children of his 1st m and an infant Jacques the Jacquette will have died before 1688 - which ties up with what Delia says.

It is 2 years ago - you know how hard it is to remember anything! - the date 12/4/1689 Aletta baptised I see is on FFYP - and no - I don't think they were the same person.

Re-worded the note

Cape Town Baptisms 1689 page 38

[De]n 17 een kindt ghedoopt waer van vader is Jacobus de Savo[..]en
de moeder Maria Magdalena le Clerq de ghetuijge sijn den
wel ed. Heer Simon van der Stel Commandeur [commandeur deese]

http://www.eggsa.org/sarecords/index.php/church-registers/cape-town...

Thanks - Yes, saw all those details, but was trying to figure out what your note meant - whether you were trying to fit it in with the GISA numbers. (As you say - 2 years ago!!) :-)
As to the GISA numbers - I think they are inadequate for the data we have on this de Savoye line, and - for myself - I'd scrap them rather than setting in stone incorrect data which will have to be changed for all the generations below when the other data comes to light.

I doubt that other data will come to light. There are no male lines of descent so the numbers do not make any knock on effect. I think that the numbers should stay - the tidied up children in order of birth is good and solid especially if you support it all with a note and lock the name fields.

You mean the numbers including the extra kids?
Okay - good idea, especially if there aren't male descendants.
Will do tomorrow.

We have to establish what children there were - including those that are not mentioned in Boucher who may have/probably died.

Yes, I'm hoping -faintly :-) -that we might get to the origin of those very specific baptismal dates, to help establish the validity of the 3 extra girls. Probably entered by Mavis in the Geni Cambrian era though :-)

from Boucher - French Speakers at the Cape - The European background Page 267

Reference given - G S Jacobus Geboorten, A=-Z, 1601-1700: pp 115v.; 117v.; 119; 129v.; 122v; 124v.; O, Sint-Jakops (sic), Overlijdens, A-Z, 1635-1799: pp. 285; 286; H, Sint-Baafs, Huwelijken, A-Z, 1618-1700: p. 126v. (SA Ghent). See also J. Decavele to G.C. de Wet, Aug 4 1972 (copy) (Misc. Sources)

The names of several of the children of Jacques de Savoye and Christine du Pont appear in the registers of Sint-Jacobs, the parish church for the densely populated district surrounding Ghent's Vrijdag­ markt, where in 1340 Edward III of England had been proclaimed king of France.

1. A son Jacques was baptized in June 1669 and

2. a daughter Julienne-Louise on May 16, 1671. Julienne died shortly after her christening at the age of two weeks. Both the children of this marriage who settled at the Cape were born in Ghent.

3. Marguerite-Therese was christened on September 4 , 1672 and

4. Barbe-Therese on May 20, 1674.

5. Two years later, on June 27, 1676, a son Chretien was baptized, but he did not survive infancy and was buried on September 30 of the same year.

6. Finally, the baptism of a daughter Susanne took place on January 27, 1678.

Webpage Olive Tree Ships - Oosterland (http://www.olivetreegenealogy.com/ships/sahug12.shtml)

"Ships Passenger List for Huguenot Ship Oosterland to South Africa 1688
[Oosterland] Belonged to the Chamber of Zeeland. Captain Carel van Marseveen.

Left Middelburg on 29 January 1688, and Goeree on 3 February 1688. Arrived at the Cape on 26 April, 1688.

* Jacques de Savoye (1636-1717) and Marie-Madeleine le Clercq (abt 1660-1721)
* Antoinette Carnoy (abt 1630-?)
* Marguerite-Thérèse de Savoye (1672-aft 1713)
* Barbere-Thérèse de Savoye (1674-aft 1713)
* Jacques de Savoye (1687-bef.1708)
* Daniel Nourtier (abt. 1667-1711) and Marie Vitu (abt 1668-1711)
* Jacques Nourtier (1669-1743)
* Jean Nourtier (1671- aft. 1694)

The Nourtiers were servants according to Boucher -

Savoye was accompanied to the Cape by the Nourtiers of the Calaisis as his servants. Was there also a family connection through Christine du Pont?

I wonder

You wonder what?

Was there also a family connection through Christine du Pont?

I think Boucher was querying whether the du Ponts (firsdt wife) had a connection to the Nortiers ..

also ...A daughter Jeanne would seem to have been born to the Savoyes before they settled in the Flemish city [Ghent] her marriage to Andre du Pont further cemented the alliance between these families.