Rice Pudding Part 2, Quest For Truth

you welcome to feel sorry for me sir Michael P McCann t.hats a great honnor you give me.you can call me an idiot yeah sometime i am.

Michael, I'm confused. No one did anything bad. This just isn't the conversation Dale wants to have.

Erica to tell you the truth I've never noticed. I should take a spin through some of my info and see if it mentions a day. Most of what I have is either births or deaths.Well, that will give me something to keep my mind off of having to move.

The old rhyme goes...

Monday brides will be healthy.
Tuesday brides will be wealthy.
Wednesday brides do best of all.
Thursday brides will suffer losses.
Friday brides will suffer crosses.
Saturday brides will have no luck at all.

======

My impression so far is that Puritan weddings were in the morning - 9-12, followed by a nice meal. There was a belief that it was a civil compact to be contractually witnessed by a magistrate, but I'm having trouble thinking that it wasn't actually in the church & performed by the minister.

Michael McCann: I thank you for your observations. But there has been a misunderstanding re: Marte: His description of the words being put up by another observer by the initial w was there there different ways to interpet what the writer meant. Marte was illustraiting that w had used the declaritive as a kind of judgment hoping no one would look at his motive, which was clearly to discredit the last year of my search. Marte was in no way being disrespectful to me...So I hope you understand that the use of the term idiot has it's place.....Marte was not being rude to me....that been perfectly clear for a long time. So to clear the air, please understand Marte's intent which was to point back at the person being smarmy and disrespectful to my Ancestoral search wich I had put up DNA matched person. Now if everyone will please breathe deeply and move on...this thread needs new information of the linage of PERRATT II and the May, Fox, and Borden lines which all tie back to Sir John PERROTT. Dale C. RICE 1948

martin = mart. thank you mr rice for your word.i not feel being insulted at all
and mr rice i am from quebec not france maybe like some of your ancestor =quebec or montreal or....only french province in america
http://www.news-voyageur.com/dotclear/images/quebec.jpg

or google quebec
merci MonSieur Rice

w thanks that is what i was trying to get at politely with out insulting and being mouthy and cursing like some one else..i guess anything goes on geni even words i wouldn't exactly use in front of my nephew.. I just feel there were kinder ways he could have made his point about somthings being total nonsense...

HEY YOURSELF w!

mr rice make a backup of all that was writen since day one off this discussion. then create your own dicussion.

http://www.geni.com/path/Dale+C+Rice+is+related+to+Charity+Hall?fro...

This Hall family reconnects down line at Wm. Rice Sr. and that leads back to the Foote/Churchille female line. This is part of the search of the connecting or supporting lines from Tudor through the Borden's and onto Earle which is a secondary kind of proof of affiliation in the family tree that I am building. As stated before the most we are likely to get this way is 60-40% inductive liklihood of a proof of John Perratt II to John RICE 1630.

Thus, as you find any such Mayo, Fox, STEAGER which later becomes SEAGER I would like to see it here. Thanks DCR 1948

Charity Hall (Fish)

Right age, wrong LOCATION, not to mention married elsewhere.

Dale, please, please, please - there are two "likely" locations only:

- Windham, Connecticut
- Putnam, New York

I have "Charity's" in my tree ranging from New Hamphshire to Tennessee. They are not related to you (or each other) - but if you checked a link you "would" find a connection. That's the nature of the "connected" world family tree on Geni.

Charity was a fashionable name in that era.

erica.. she is my 7th cousin 9 times removed. thanks for finding yet another tangled line for me to sort thru later.

as i said before i wish i could be of more help but I can't because past certin ancestors in this case I only have a good knowlege up to Nathaniel Bassett of yarmouth ma

Dale,

I think I'm going to "unfollow" this discussion. It was all very interesting (if frustrating) when you had two or three real genealogists trying to help you; I thought I might be able to help myself, a little bit. But Erica seems to be the only one who can still put up with this.

And your chosen line of research (DNA) seems not to be one which you follow rigorously yourself. If it seems to conflict with a paper trail you ignore the paper trail except where it seems to lead where you want it to lead.

I think your grandmother was exceptionally well-read, but the trouble is that a lot of what she read was false. This would have been the case for anyone at her time, and for that matter it is the case for us. Think of any branch of knowledge at your grandmother's time, and what you will find is that some people advanced (i.e. got closer to) "truth" but even their advances have been superceded. The advance of knowledge depends on a willingness to accept that any hypothesis can be disproved. Einstein posited in his First Theory of Relativity three experiments which should lead to certain results which would make it the most likely hypothesis; if any of them failed, he said, his theory was wrong. If all of them succeeded (as they did) his theory was probable, but still not proved.

Mark

Well Mark, i will miss your observations...I am linking all the stories I can. Finding a name that connects to my downline family as Hall does is interesting. I did not make any claim other than the Hall's are downline. My point being that the American side is tangled but becomming less so. As The very specific names of the descendents of PERRATT II the named father of JOHN RICE are seen in the secondary or tertiary lines that connect over here...they will lead us back to the source of DNA.

Remember, I have identified other bastard lines of Tudor DNA . They also happen to match John RICE 1630. They are Richard Edwardes, Thomas Stuckley, Robert Tudor Fychan, and the RICES were in the right place at the right time to have continueous relationships both personal and professional with the Crown at many levels and over many years. You can see that the Manning line Connects to RICE and the Kings of ENGLAND.

Let us not presume that History written by the Vicotorious Tudors is the true History of events. Same for people who interacted with the Tudors.

My DNA lines are getting more and more clear and Charity Rice is becoming more likely to be the link that's missing, but once known will link to MAYO, Fox, and Borden who are named in the testimony. The testimony was very, very specific and hard to listen to, and no one makes up the kind of beginning of JOHN RICE 1630 by starting as a brother to half sister relationshp. That continues to be discounted in the underlying logic. Kind Regards to Mr. Dickinson...I regard you participation as a gift. Dale C. Rice 1948

PS: Mark, I would not be on the Radar of Z-58 which includes the names of Phillips, Perrott, White and now RICE if the DNA were Wrong. We simply don't have the Clairity to judge yet. But the DNA for RICHARD III should make everyone sit up and take notice. Especially if the French King Phillip IV of Normandy turns up as I-1 which would lead to Richard III YES?

Oh, my God, you people are out of control! Dale ,Mart , and W , get a grip on it. Genealogy is suppose to be fun as well as informative. This ain't either at this point! This is not helping the so called world tree.This is not helping the individual person. It's driving people away to other places.

i got no probleme at all madame loubris exept that some got a dog in this fight. since the beginin ,i dont give in those kid act or drama scenario and the use of word to abuse

talking genealogy seriously and talkin difamatory its another level

i will not pretend to play the victime or the asaillant ..not sur it english word but i am not giving mind play

SOOOOOOOO
W want to remoove himself from the discussion. farewell no need to vote your are dimissed,

few day of silence for few participant is a good thing after talking real genealogy .we are lucky few among us got real backgroung in history as genealogy but when i talk of my french side genealogy or woman genealogy evry one ran away or change the direction of the discussion. i am looking of each of participant tree to found french root from canada quebec also in other contry language is this possible that alot of ancestor was realy close related?

since the beginin i got not path to mr rice yesterday i have found the link not to bad after near one year.

genealogy pedegree and genealogy from mother is a diferent thinking maybe mr Swanström can give more explaination diferent point of view about this.

whenever those word are say i take it madame loubris and forgive us as man...from view of those that beleive they are.

talk like a man or act like a man my mother and father say!

i am looking to rice conection cause i do beleive the quest of mr rice since the beginin

Thanks to Cousin Marte of Canada my search for the Quaker Perrott is now over....we have the direct link to him born 1572 as the testimony of 1978 stated. FEAST your eyes upon this sequence of names. We are closing in on Charity I am hopeful now. This was done by staying true to the TESTIMONY and finally someone recognized the family associations of FOX, Mayo, SAUNDERS, and yes PERROTT: This is how it is supposed to work.....others will have a piece that I did not have and share it....This was the purpose of this thread!!!!
John "the Quaker" Perrot

Please Thank Marte for his stepping up and taking a chance and he has uncovered other links that I was sure were there including a 3rd route to John Lackland via his French connections. I am thrilled to be at this point and do not care what others who are tired of my search feel. My approach worked and the above is the proof. Now I have to run down the cousins to see where on earth CHARITY fits into this SCHEMA. I told you so....for some HUBRIS got in the way...I expected to have to fight for this and Now I can share this great find with others of GOOD WILL! Dale C. RICE 1948

http://www.geni.com/path/Dale+C+Rice+is+related+to+John+the+Quaker+...

This is the complete link to me......We are nearly there people! SMILE Broadly Marte....this is your contribution !!! DCR 1948

I don't expect congratulations from the crowd who say I didn't prove anything yet. My point was to find the pieces to a story that I could not understand. The John Perratt II son of Sir John Perrott 1527 is such a piece. The relatedness of the downline persons of an actual relationship are shown in the names on the link. THIS is what I tried to describe as a secondary or tertiary proof of the story.... we are still in the HUNT for more links of EDWARDES, STUCKLEY'S, and others Such as Wm. Owen Tudor of WALES but the links are there....we must find and assemble them under the heading of I-1 Haplogroup M-253 snp and perhaps even Z-58 once I get an advanced DNA test done.

The testimony of my father in Late October of 1978 Was Accurate, and we are on the way to PROVING it true by Inductive method at a better than 60%-40% . I think this find raises the odds of the story being True to 70-30% and JUSTIN: the finds you made are the finds which linked all this together. Including the 1/2 Sister question you poses two weeks back indicating a NPE. Dale C. RICE 1948

mr rice thank you for those nice words but i cant acept anything from my own. its geni and all the people that work together that make it possible connexion/ language is only a close door that need a key and we got all in this world a piece of that key .

alot of effort was made by all the participant

its only the beginin mr rice
mart =marte lol

Ms Erica: This is the Churchill Line my father told me about in 1978. I recognize the Name MELLOR became Miller later. The Mnemonic I used was with the girl I went to school with in the 60's . Here's the link. I will chase this down if you think it worth while. DCR

http://stephaniechurchillling.wordpress.com/category/family-history...

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=PED&db=dowfa...

The Testimony of 1978 Referred to Moon, Handee, and Borden....you will see them here. DCR 1948

http://www.google.com/search?q=John+Churchill+Radcliffe+1600&sa...

The Radcliffe Line is sometimes used in place of RICE. Perhaps here? John Radcliffe Churchill would be the line to John Churchill perhaps? DCR1948

Dale

Re: http://stephaniechurchillling.wordpress.com/category/family-history...

1) This has been previously discussed several times. There is an Internet tree error. Geni reflects the "best known" -

Rev. John Churchill

Please re read the notes and report back your understanding of what they say. Perhaps I need to clarify them further for you?

2) you do not have a Churchill line, of any sort, in your tree: direct blood line (father > mother or whatever) or sibling marriage. It is possible, geographically, that there was a collateral relationship somewhere.

http://www.geni.com/path/Dale+C+Rice+is+related+to+Edward+III+of+En...

This is the Direct link of the RICE's of DEDHAM to John Lackland and Edward III Kings of ENGLAND. This is certainly a FAIR Indicator that the testimony of 1978 was Accurate....YES?

My point here is that we have John PERRATT II the Quaker in an indirect link to the John RICE 1630 of DEDHAM above. And this link is the other half of the assertion that we link to Edward III fairly directly through the WILSON Marriage to RICE. This leads me to the conclusion that Perrott ap RICE was indeed fathered by John PERRATT II and the testimony says that PERRATT II the Quaker is alson the father of JOHN RICE 1630 by Perrott ap RICE's daugher Margaret ap RICE 1618.

Troubled, Turbulent times yielded a Troubled and Turbulent beginning to the family in AMERICA we now know was begun in England as my father said. Let the discussions over the last year sink in....I hope you conclude as I have the testimony is TRUE! DCR 1948

Ms Erica: Im not qualified to analyize the John Churchill line. I simply refer to the RAdcliffe Churchil as a connection because my sister's doccumentation reflects the names as interchangable for some reason. It's merely a question I had. I hope you can see that we are well on the way to understanding the Perratt II linkage to my father is important. We are still working inductively here....acknowlidgeing there could be an error. I sincerely hope not. DCR 1948

http://www.genetic-genealogy.co.uk/Toc115570138.html

GENETIC AND QUANTITATIVE ASPECTS OF GENEALOGY 
TYPES OF COLLATERAL RELATIONSHIPS

"It is important to get the terminology correct for the different kinds of relationship. I have used path diagrams to demonstrate the differences and have also included the coefficient of relationship (R) between members of each type. ..."

Dale - you are qualified to read and understand the notes in the Rev. John Churchill profile, and deduct implications from it, aren't you?

That's why I asked you to reflect back to us "what they mean.". Because if it's not clear, I'm sure we can clarify.

So - reading the notes in the profile - what does it say about descent from Rev. John Churchill?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dementia

"Dementia is a serious loss of global cognitive ability in a previously unimpaired person, beyond what might be expected from normal aging . . . . . . . .it can occur before the age of 65, in which case it is termed "early onset dementia".