Henry VII of England - Haplogroup I1 is the likely subclade of the Tudor Dynasty

Oh certainly not....Justin: My interest in John Rice Hughes is that the name chosen by Perrott after 1640 was the name and identity of his blood born Brother Captain John Rice, also born at about 1600. My inquiry to them was simply to ask if they had record of John Rice Hughes in the family? As a point of departure....I had no infor other than their status as Curator and that sometimes means there is a blood connection is all. The hughes name is significat to the Rices since they married into the Hughes family and a Hughes was Drawn and Quartered as the best man of Griffeth ap Gruffed ap Rhys ap Thomas in the plot to overthrow Henry VIII. This man Hughes or Captin John Rice has the Griffeth Name in his ancestory as well as the Rhys ap Thomas line.....interesting NO? My family doccuments state that after homesteading in the Adirondacks in 1642 or thereabouts which was indian territory back then according to the letters we have and Ms. Erica....the family of Rice Huges sponsors a son of Perrott's born 1645 named Thomas in 1652....no location given meaning that the James River Location and nickitti the native woman in his company was the branch of the Family in America comeletely seperated from John Rice 1624 of Dedham Ma. The confluance of the story and OttEr lake near the trading post are COINCIDENTAL and of interest to me and what happened to the EXTRA john Rice as recorded by the ERA association that says neither one were related to EDMUND....not by blood at least....but as I've explained earlier...there family connection is far more deep than has been acknowledged....My inquiry was general in nature not specific....fyi DCR 1948

Sorrry, Perrot's son Thomas ap Rice or Price born 1635 before Perrott disappeared came to James City 1652 sponsored by Rice Hughes with no location which i take to mean James River Trading post....DCR

Lots of Welsh arrivals to early Virginia!

They were, as far as I know, un related to Rice families from East Anglia, who were also unrelated to each other.

Are you chasing a surname, Dale?

I did that & it doesn't usually pan out. I am NOT a Hoghton, Houghton, Haughton, Hocton, Hooten, or Horeton except where lines coincide. The names have a common derivation in old Anglo Saxon, that's all.

Sure, I have no problem with a Perrot (family) axis to James River trading posts & the Barbados (and other West Indies?) shipping & trade routes.

But I think you are missing something very fundamental in getting a handle on migrations, & marriages. Once that info clicks into place for you I believe it will assist your investigations.

There's a wonderful book by historian David Hackett Fisher called "Albion's Seed." It describes the 4 (main) groups who migrated from the British islands to Colonial America & the cultures they brought with them that still resonate today.

In the early 1600s there were 2 separate & distinct groups:

1. Merchant adventurers to VA from the south & west of England
2. Religious refugees to New England from the north & east of England

Check it out & you'll better understand some of my questions to you.

Justin, the Tudor Hen grouping of ancestors to Owen Tudor is sounding very right as they connect to Edmund mortimer through the Plantagenants...I recall a very convoluted ancestory regarding Edmund and the Nevills which you cleared up do they likewise connect to the Ancient Hen leaders as my mother indicated prior to her passing...do have that at your fingertips? Never once did they say TUDOR....which is the pause I have about Henry VIII, yet Perrott ap Rice only connects to that family via owen's children....I don't think it really matter much because the Link seems to be so clear to John Rice 1624 and TAMZIN Frost RICE.... DCR 1948

Oh! I think I forgot to thank you for recommending Albion's Seed to me months ago, Erica, but I loved it and learned so much. Thank you for a spot-on recommendation!

Please continue this discussion here:
http://www.geni.com/discussions/134239

There are mainly RM269 13 people in this group

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Tudor-Tutor-Tuder?iframe=ycolo...

Funnily enough, it's not far from https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Dimmick?iframe=ycolorized who are meant to be Tudor cousins.

The conqueror's haplgroup is not I. Especially since his mother was jewish.

Do you have a connection to William the Conqueror? There is an estimate that 25% of the population of England is related to Bill the Conq. From a y-DNA perspective, this percentage would be lower. If you have one of these surnames; Bartelott, Beaumont, Bruce, Clifford, Corbett, D’Arcy, Devereaux, Giffard, Molyneaux, Montgomery, Mortimer, Norton, Osbern, Pearsall, Ramsey, Spencer, St. Clair, Stewart, Talbott, Umfreville (Humphrey) or Warren and match the 37-marker William the Conqueror Modal Haplotype (WCMH), you may be related.

DYS393

DYS390

DYS19

DYS391

DYS385a

DYS385b

DYS426

DYS388

DYS439

DYS389i

DYS392

DYS389ii

13

24

14

11

11

14

12

12

12

13

13

29

DYS458

DYS459a

DYS459b

DYS455

DYS454

DYS447

DYS437

DYS448

DYS449

DYS464a

DYS464b

DYS464c

DYS464d

17

9

10

11

11

25

15

19

29

15

15

17

17

DYS460

Y-GATA-H4

YCAIIa

YCAIIb

DYS456

DYS607

DYS576

DYS570

CDYa

CDYb

DYS442

DYS438

11

11

19

23

15

15

17

17

36

37

12

12

an’t say that this is exactly William the Conqueror’s y-DNA markers. These values are a mode, the numbers that appear most frequently in the related R1b sample of 152 records. The results that I have found are based on my analysis of about 3,800 y-DNA samples and form a good correlation. New data in the future may change the results.

The techniques that I have used are similar to the ones used to identify Carthaigh (McCarthy King of Desmond), Niall of the Nine Hostages and Genghis Khan. I predict that as the DNA databases grow, more discoveries like this will be found. My next projects are to determine Rollo’s origin (see Exploring Rollo...) and Charlemagne’s haplotype.

Reference:

Maglio, MR (2013) A Y-Chromosome Signature of Polygyny in Norman England (
Link)

©Michael R. Maglio and OriginsDNA

Melissa, Jessica, you're jumping in on a long-dead thread.

You should also know (both of you) that Dale C. Rice continued spinning wackier and wackier theories, and getting more and more upset when they were easily exploded. He never learned a thing from all the discussions on DNA (although the rest of us did!), and he never gave up on his "family story" about being descended from the Tudors no matter how implausible it became.

* Jessica, you're repeating some of Dale's mistakes for the same reason - inadequate understanding of what DNA is all about, and refusal to accept that it doesn't prove what you want it to prove. *

I'm sad to hear this. It's wishful thinking by a handful of people who don't understand the science. DNA is not yet this sophisticated. We might get there someday but we're not there yet.

The more information you give the more it will be snipped, don't tell them anything