Robert Moodie, Jr. - Stuart, Mudie og the Moodie book

Det er vel foreløbig ingen som har kommet frem med bevis for at Robert Moodie Jr er sønn av oven nevnte Adam Mudie og Christina Stewart. Men Robert var uten tvil fra en velstående familie, og kjøpte opp store eiendommer i Bergen og nord-norge. Roberts sønn igjen ble giftet bort til datteren av den rikeste og mektigste mannen i Astafjord området da familien flyttet nordover. Hvis vi dessuten tar med at Roberts bestefar i følge denne slektsgreinen het Robert, og var jarl på Orkenøyene, så er det vel ting som tyder på at dette kan være korrekt (med vekt på KAN). Hvis dette stemmer så er vi da direkte etterkommere av Tudor og Stewart-familiene som regjerte England og Skottland i århundrer. Vurderer nå å ta en slik DNA test for å få klarhet i hvor mine forfedre egentlig kom fra.
Kanskje vi får bevis for at vi virkelig er av kongelig byrd...

Hi
I know this may be a bit much to ask but could you please put your comments in English as well? Or, could you please tell me what language this is so I can get a translator.
The reason I haven't approved any changes to Adam Mudie of Breckness and Master William Mudie of Breckness is because I am still looking for evidence to prove that Moodie and Mudie are the same.
Thank you.

Frank Bendiktsen and Håkon Mikkelsen write their comments in Norwegian language.

Hi Brendan!
I wrote that so far nobody has come up with evidence for Robert Moody Jr beeing the same person as the Robert Moddy that came to Bergen and later on up to Northern Norway.
But Robert Moddy had to come from a wealthy family since he bought lots of properties and land here in Norway. So I say that he might be the son of Adam Mudie and Christina Stewart. (I`m not saying that it IS so,,,)
With Christinas father being named Robert, it makes sence that her son is named Robert as well . I also wrote that I will soon take a DNA-test to see if I am related to the Stewarts or Tudors in any way..
Hopefully we can solve this mystery together!

Thanks Arnfred and Frank.
I see a few people are making changes to a some related or connected profiles without providing any evidence in the About Me section. Which is a problem for me because they are part or are directly connected to my project - http://www.geni.com/projects/South-Africa-History-and-Families-of-W...
And no one has provided any evidence for changing the first name of Christian Stewart
from Christian to Christina so until that happens I think I should change it back to Christian. What do you think?
I am looking forward to your DNA test results.

Wow, thanks Hakon for introducing me to The Moodie Book at -
http://archive.org/stream/moodiebookbeinga00ruvi#page/n3/mode/2up
I shall look in there for any evidence of 'Christina'. Very interesting book, which makes me think I must buy a Kindle or tablet! :-)

@ Adam Mudie of Breckness

I found this, that can help ?

"RECORDS OF THE EARLDOM OP ORKNEY 271

CLVI

Charter of feu-farm by Robert Stewart, fcuar of the croAvn lands of Orkney and Shetland, to Mr. William Mudy of Breckness and his heirs, of the kings lands in
Outer Stromness, and others.

Original in Latin in possession of Mrs. Watt of Breckness.

January 20th, 1563-64. Kirkwall.

Robert Stewart, feuar, etc., grants to Mr. William Mudy of Breknes for his life, and to Adam Mudye his eldest lawful son and Grizel Stewart, daughter of the said Robert Stewart, apparent spouse to the said Adam, and the sur- vivor of them in conjunct fee and their lawful heirs male, but so that one heir male only successively after the other shall enjoy and possess, according to the custom of Scot- land, these lands following, notwithstanding the municipal
laws or custom of the country of Orkney being to the contrary,' all and sundry the 7 penny, 3 farthing King's lands of Uttir Stromnes, | penny land called Stannagarth, and the quoy called Smethyquoy. Pertinents enumerated in usual feudal form. Payments : — 21 meils, 5 settings ' of meal commonly called cost,' at 5/ per meil, extending to £5 9s. 2d. in money: 12 meils, 5| sett flesh, at 3/ per meil, extending to 38/9d. in money : 2 stones or lispounds and 14 marks of oil, at 4/ per stone, extending to 10/4d in money ; and 6/4d. in money scat, all being the old duties. Also in augmentation of rental 25d., coming altogether to £8 16/, to be paid at Whitsunday and Martinmas in equal portions. Likewise three suits of court to be rendered at the three head courts to be held yearly at the town of Kirkwall or elsewhere, and the feu duty to be doubled in the first year of the heirs' entry. Clause of warrandice in the usual feudal form. Precept of sasine directed to Edward Bettoun. At Kirkwall, January 20th, 1563. 1

1 Sic, though this is antecedent to the first recorded grant of the crown lands to Robert Stewart.

http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/scottish-history-society-cn/p...

page 30.

Thank you, Stein.

I am one of the many from the destrict of "Sør-Troms" in Northern Norway who is related to Robert Mudie. In my familys there were also stories saying that our family was related to "lords" .

After starting genealogy I can see that this has be the Moddy/Moodie-branch of the family.

I have also read "The Moodie Book" and found Robert Mudie, son of Adam Mudie and brother of Francis Mudie, last mentioned in court protoclos 28th November 1610, or possibly 26th May 1614

"III. Robert Mudie appears as the brother of Francis Mudie of Breckness in various complaints before the Privy Council 12th April 1610, 6th September 1610, and 28th November 1610. It is possible that he was the Robert Mudie, a tenant of Lord Forbes in Latheron parish, Caithness, who, according to a complaint before the Privy Council of the 26th May 1614, had, by Lord Forbes' order, gone with other tenants to the landss of Berriedale, belonging to Lord Sinclair of Berriedale, and attacked one Robert Keyth, his servant. " - (16 The Moodie Book)

After this time I have not been able to find anything about where he was living and that makes it possible he immegrated to Bergen...

At geni.com someone has registreted that he was born in 1590. Anybody who knows where this information is found?

Jan R

We've put this line on the Medieval Scotland Scratchpad project: http://www.geni.com/projects/Medieval-Scotland-Scratchpad-for-resea... as something that we're researching to get a best possible descent line for Geni.

Could you please post a link to the exact line because I followed your link all the way to the top, Nils Nillsen, and didn't see any Robert Moody so perhaps he married further down in one of the other lines but it'll take a long time to find.

Robert Moodie ofg Francis Moodie behover nodvendigvis ikke aa ha samme mor, selv om de kalles broedre. Det kan man se om man gaar til Adams mor Catherine Sinclair som maa ha vaert gift tidliger med en
Mr. Robson. Hennes Soen John Robson kaller William Mudy sin bror.

CXLI

Disposition, John Robson to his brother William Mudy, of the half of Leirquoy in Stromness.

Original in possession of the Venerable Archdeacon Craven, D.D.

May 27th, 1554. Kirkwall.

Be it kend till all men be this present writ, me Johne Robsoun, son and ane of the lauchfull airis of innqnhill Kattrine Sinclair my moder, to have sauld, annaleit, and ofhent, and be the tenour of thir presentis sellis, annaleis, and ofhentis fra me my airis, executouris, and assignais, to [my] weilbelovit broder William Mudy, his airis and assignais, all and haill the ane half of Leirquhy hand in Wttertoime in Stromness in Orknay, with all rycht and roytht pertenand thairto, with housis, begynnis, toftis, croftis, and uthir pertenance quhatsumevir, for the soume of four poundis usuall money of Scotland, thankfullie
giffin and payit to me the said Johne Robsoun be the handis of the said William in my gret mister and urgent necessity. [He discharges William Mudy of the price and warrants him in the land, 'asweill as ony siclik land is brukit within the lord- schipe of Orknay,' along with ' all rycht titill of rycht roytht.']

In witnessing of the quhilk thing, becaus I the said Johne hed nocht ane proper seill of myne awine, I have procurat with instance the seill of ane venerabill
man Maister Petir Huxtone subdane of Orknay to be hungyne to thir presentis chartour of alienatioun, at Kirkwall the twenty sevin day of Maii in the yeir of
God m. v c fyfty four zeris, befoir thir witnes, venerabill and discrct men, Maister Petir Huxtone subdane forsaid ; Schir Johne Gifferd, chorist of the cathedral] kirk of Orknay ; Maister Johne Huxtone, scoill maister ; Alexander Cromarty ; Henry Chahnir ; Andro Scartane, with uthiris divers. (Signed) ' Petrus Houstoun, subdecanus Orchaden.'

[Seal gone.]

http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/scottish-history-society-cn/p...

s.28

I have added link to "Jordbok 1652" to the profile of Robert Moodie. He requests to pay 10 riksdaler less in "tax" for properties in Norhern Norway, which was approved. At the last page is his name (signature?). Is it likely that he could read and write?

http://arkivverket.no/URN:db_read/rk/15468/5/?size=full&mode=0

I recieved the test results from FTDNA today, and they show an exact match with members of the Mac Donald clan! This clan hails from Donald, 3rd lord of the isles, and he was the grandson of the famous Sommerled of the isles!

Wow! Frank, that's amazing. Well done.

Private User Interressant diskusjon som har pågått her tidligere i år. Noen som har kommet noe nærmere gåten om Robert Moodie?

Hvor stammer antakelsen fra om at Robert Mudie fra Orkenøyene er identisk med Robert Moodie som dukker opp i hhv Bergen og Bjarkøy?

@Robert Moodie

Esau Moddi var trolig av skotsk avstamning og kom fra en slekt som på 1650-tallet hadde ervervet seg betydelige eiendommer i Bjarkøy og på yttersida av Senja. Faren, Robert Moddi, eide i 1661 både Sundsvold (2 våg), Helløya (1,5 våg) og Buvik (1 våg) i Bjarkøy. Trolig var han kommet i besittelse av disse gårdene gjennom et arveoppgjør etter Nils Pedersen Lem i Bergen, - et arveoppgjør som også omfattet Senjehesten og Sjursvik på sørvestspissen av Senja. I tillegg kjøpte han opp gårdene Skaland og Bø i Berg - hver på én våg. Størstedelen av disse eiendommene var gammelt Bjarkøygods, som hadde gått i arv gjennom forskjellige adelsslekter, men som i første halvdel av 1600-tallet var blitt overtatt av bergensborgere. Robert Moddi hadde også tilknytning til Bergen, uten at vi vet sikkert om han hadde løst borgerskap. I hvert fall trakk han seg tilbake dit før han ca. 1666.

Astafjord Historie 2, s. 86-88

Jeg lurte paa her, hvorfor arveoppgjør fra Nils Pedersen Lem i Bergen., d.1640. Ved aa lese litt om denne fogeden dukket det opp
en skotte; Mr. Robert Cheyne of Vaila. Han var svigersønn til John Mowats mor Ursulla Tullich. John var videre gift med Christian Stewart

http://histfam.familysearch.org/getperson.php?personID=I293373&...

Er det mulig Christian Stewart ogsaa er mor til Robert Moodie ?

Interessant Stein. Har noen spørsmål til dette:
1. Hvilke kilde dokumenterer at Mr. Robert Cheyne of Vaila var svigersønn til John Mowats mor, Ursullla Tullich?
2. Hva het konen til Robert Cheyne of Vaila?
3. Hva var relasjonen mellom Nils Pedersen Lem og Robert Cheyne of Vaila?

Robert Cheyne of Vaila er registrert født ca. 1542 på Geni.com. I flg University of St Andrews giftet Ursulla Tullich seg med Andrew Mowat rundt 1558. Basert på disse dataene finner jeg det lite sannsynlig at Robert Cheyne var svigersønn til Ursulla Tullich.

@Moodie

Fru Inger of Austrat was a widow and a very important figure in Norwegian aristocracy. She claimed the Giske estates as well as some of the Meløy estates in Norway, in addition to the Papa and Papaquids estates in Shetland. As Inger did not live in Shetland, she appointed Ursula’s father William Tulloch to manage the estates for her. Around 1543, William Tulloch acquired the lease of “Papa & Papaquids” from Fru Inger.
On William's death, prior to 1558, his daughter Ursula was his heiress; there seems to be an agreement that the lease would pass to her and her husband Andrew Mowat of Hugoland. Andrew was appointed “tutor” to Ursula’s brother, John Tulloch, in 1558, which indicates John was too young to take on the lease. After the death of Fru Inger of Austrat, her son-in-law Robert Cheyne came to an agreement with the Norwegian proprietor over the “Papa Property.” He ejected Andrew and Ursula from the island and overturned their right to assume control of the income produced by Papa and Papaquids. The evidence for this come from letters written by Mary, Queen of Scots herself, to one Jens Split as the chief proprietor and the Norwegian authorities on behalf of Andrew and Ursula in September 1566. These papers refer to Andrew and Ursula’s rights of possession.
Queen Mary’s letter had the desired effect, as it confirmed Andrew and Ursula's right to the lands of Papa and Papaquids. The confirmations were granted at different times between 1570 and 1576 by all the different proprietors. These arrangements were then confirmed in the Scottish courts. The Mowatts were also given the Great Seal of the Realm insuring their firm legal right to the lands of Papa and Papaquids.
One of the privileges granted to Andrew Mowatt in 1577 was a right to build a house and fortress on Papa. Mowatt descendants at some time did build a residence there called ‘Northhouse,’ with the Mowat coat of arms visible on the gateway entrance. However, Andrew and Ursula Mowatt did not take residence there themselves, living instead in Ollaberry, Northmaven. Andrew Mowatt later acquired lands in Hardanger, Gjersvik and Hovland, communities in Norway.

http://www.123people.com/e/andrew+mowat

Desverre er linken til dette ikke lengre tilgjengelig. Har ogsaa støttet meg til NST-XXXVI, s.214

Litt uklart "her son-in-law Robert Cheyne" hvem hans svigermor er.

25 sept. 1558 var Ursulla Tulloch gammel nok til aa arve sin far og hun var ogsaa gift med Anders Mowat. Bjørn Brox nevner to døtre som han mener er født mellom 1549 og ...

3, relasjonen mellom Nils Pedersen Lem og Robert Cheyne of Vaila:

Det må være denne Mette Pedersdatter som er en stor jordeier på Voss, Hordaland. Enkelte eierforhold i Hordaland/Rogaland tyder på en forbindelse til
Orm på Tokheim og Torbjørn på Sandvin, g.m. hhv. Anna og Christina Petersdøtre, n. bl.a i 1575-6 i forb. med avståelse av jord til Mr. Robert Cheyne of
Vaila of lands in Shetland. Andrew Lamb of Southtyre,indweller in the town of Leith, er nevnt i et dok. dat. Edinburgh 29.juni 1566,hvor sitat; has become
caution for Ola Sinclaire of Avera that mr. Robert Cheyne and his servants and kinsmen shall be unharmed and skaithless of the said Ola and all others he
may prevent, without fraud or guile, exept by order of law, according to the form an tenor of the queen's letters directed thereupon and under the paints
contained therein. Sitat slutt. Åpenbart en rik herre, siden han hadde betalt £ 1,000 for 'his ship which brak at Scheitland as his acquittance'Ref.Shetland
documents 1195-1579, nr. 221, 152,266) I 1521 er det reg. en skotte på Tokheim i Odda, dessverre uten navn.

http://forum.arkivverket.no/topic/112534-26905-huseby-i-brunla-len-...

Mette Pedersdatter Jerskjegg, Nils Pedersen Lems kone.

Esau Moddi var trolig av skotsk avstamning og kom fra en slekt som på 1650-tallet hadde ervervet seg betydelige eiendommer i Bjarkøy og på yttersida av Senja. Faren, Robert Moddi, eide i 1661 både Sundsvold (2 våg), Helløya (1,5 våg) og Buvik (1 våg) i Bjarkøy. Trolig var han kommet i besittelse av disse gårdene gjennom et arveoppgjør etter Nils Pedersen Lem i Bergen, - et arveoppgjør som også omfattet Senjehesten og Sjursvik på sørvestspissen av Senja. I tillegg kjøpte han opp gårdene Skaland og Bø i Berg - hver på én våg. Størstedelen av disse eiendommene var gammelt Bjarkøygods, som hadde gått i arv gjennom forskjellige adelsslekter, men som i første halvdel av 1600-tallet var blitt overtatt av bergensborgere. Robert Moddi hadde også tilknytning til Bergen, uten at vi vet sikkert om han hadde løst borgerskap. I hvert fall trakk han seg tilbake dit før han ca. 1666.

Astafjord Historie 2, s. 86-88

Her lurte jeg paa hvorfor Robert Moodie fikk arveoppgjør fra Nils Pedersen Lem og linken var muligens Robert Cheyne of Vaila ??

I denne setningen tolker jeg at Robert Cheyne er Fru Ingers sønnesønn:
"After the death of Fru Inger of Austrat, her son-in-law Robert Cheyne..."
Men i flg Store norske leksikon var ingen av døtrene til Fru Inger gift med Robert Cheyne. Det er imidlertid her oppgitt at en av svigersønnene til Fru Inger var Jens Split, som forøvrig er nevnt i innlegget til Stein. Kilde: http://nbl.snl.no/Ingerd_Ottesdotter

Informasjon jeg har sett på nettet om Ursulla Tullich og ektemannen Andrew Mowat, nevner ikke at noen av deres to døtre var gift med Robert Cheyne: "Barbara, married Edward Sinclair of Scalloway. Catherine, married John Neven of Scousburgh". Kilde: http://www.cosoft.org/mowat/hugoland.html

Mulig det kan ligge en forklaring på arveoppgjøret skjult her, men det krever nok ytterligere undesøkelser...

@Robert Moodie

Sønnesønn paa engelsk er vel grandson. Det hadde forøvrig hjulpet om
flere kunne ta tak i denne problemstillingen.

Beklager feil i mitt forrige innlegg, mente SVIGERSØNN og ikke sønnesønn.

På denne linken http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bobwolfe/gen/mn/m27741x27743.htm finner vi tre saker som omhandler Christian Stewart og John Mowat (sønn av tidligere omtalte Ursulla Tullich og Andrew Mowat). Tilknytningen til Papa på Shetland er interessant i forhold til innlegg fra Stein datert 7.4.2014 hvor også eiendom på Papa nevnes. Arkivet på Shetland har dokumentert de to siste offentlige dokumentene som er oppgitt som kilder i linken.

@ Robert Moodie

Vet ikke om man følger Moodie diskusjonen, men mye spennende der.

http://www.disnorge.no/slektsforum/viewtopic.php?p=625032

@Robbert Moodie

Jeg deltar i diskusjonen på disnorge.no som Stein viser til. Veldig fint om flere ønsker å delta i diskusjonen som dessverre har dabbet litt av nå på vårparten:)

Har sett alt for mye drittkasting uten at moderatorrer griper inn på disnorge sine diskusjoner til å ville delta der.

Bjørn, jeg synes det var en unødvendig kommentar som du godt kan slette.